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[Mechwarrior:Online] Weapon Rebalancing on the 21st. Oosik Sigs on P19

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Posts

  • BastableBastable Registered User regular
    Ok giant robot chaps, been a while so I brought a dragon.
    Changed to double heat sinks, replaced engine with a 295 std to gain one tone so I can fit 2 med lasers. (Along side the Ultra5 and LRM 10).

    Question was this a good idea.
    Philippe about the tactical deployment of german Kradschützen during the battle of Kursk:
    "I think I can comment on this because I used to live above the Baby Doll Lounge, a topless bar that was once frequented by bikers in lower Manhattan."

  • KayKay Registered User regular
    LRM10 isn't.

    If you got the one with 2 ballistic, 2 energy and 2 missile, consider 2xSSRM2 in the CT.

    Otherwise, lose the LRM and pick up a large laser or PPC maybe.
    Atherton Kess in The Vale of Buried Shadows - AC:22, F:19, R:19, W:20 - Resist Force 10
    Alénthian, the Grace of Corellon in Dragon Slayers - AC:35, F:29, R:30, W:31
  • GaslightGaslight It's not your fault Video games are amazingRegistered User regular
    Bastable wrote: »
    Ok giant robot chaps, been a while so I brought a dragon.
    Changed to double heat sinks, replaced engine with a 295 std to gain one tone so I can fit 2 med lasers. (Along side the Ultra5 and LRM 10).

    Question was this a good idea.

    No, probably not.

    Dragons need speed. I wouldn't go any lower than the stock 300 engine in one. And a single UAC/5 and a single LRM 10 aren't really going to do much.
    steam_sig.png
  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    Gaslight wrote: »
    Bastable wrote: »
    Ok giant robot chaps, been a while so I brought a dragon.
    Changed to double heat sinks, replaced engine with a 295 std to gain one tone so I can fit 2 med lasers. (Along side the Ultra5 and LRM 10).

    Question was this a good idea.

    No, probably not.

    Dragons need speed. I wouldn't go any lower than the stock 300 engine in one. And a single UAC/5 and a single LRM 10 aren't really going to do much.

    295, 300... close enough. a single UAC5 can do fantastic damage, just gotta hang back. id maybe drop in twin srm4s, an ac10, large laser somewhere.

    im guessing its the 1C? for super fun times get the 5N, an XL300 and triple ac2s.
    n90uZGq.png
  • GaslightGaslight It's not your fault Video games are amazingRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Gaslight wrote: »
    Bastable wrote: »
    Ok giant robot chaps, been a while so I brought a dragon.
    Changed to double heat sinks, replaced engine with a 295 std to gain one tone so I can fit 2 med lasers. (Along side the Ultra5 and LRM 10).

    Question was this a good idea.

    No, probably not.

    Dragons need speed. I wouldn't go any lower than the stock 300 engine in one. And a single UAC/5 and a single LRM 10 aren't really going to do much.

    295, 300... close enough. a single UAC5 can do fantastic damage, just gotta hang back. id maybe drop in twin srm4s, an ac10, large laser somewhere.

    Meh. 295 to 300 is only a difference of like 2kph but that's still worth more than saving a single ton in my mind. Ideally I'd like to run a lot bigger than a 300 in a Dragon...I've got a 360 in my Flame, so maybe I'm an outlier. In any case, the DRG is a chassis where I figure an XL engine is pretty much a requirement to get the most out of it.

    And I am still not buying a single UAC/5 being viable. DPS on paper looks good but that figure is pretty much assuming you can double-fire continuously without jamming.

    If this is the 1C, you can't do twin SRM4s, it only has one missile hardpoint. I'd almost consider doing something like a battery of large lasers with maybe an SRM6 in the nose, then leave the right arm totally empty and see how many not-so-observant people waste time trying to shoot it off.

    [DRG-1C]: 3xLLAS, SRM6, 335XL, DHS, Endo

    I'm sure that can be improved upon, it's just a thrown together build.

    But since @Bastable mentioned the Ultra to begin with, I think this is not a 1C he has, perhaps a 5N? Indeed, the 5N with triple AC/2s is great fun in my experience, provided you stay back and/or engage distracted targets. If you want something a little more well-rounded (and cheaper, since DRG's tend to cost a fortune to kit out), there's this:

    [DRG-5N]: 2xMLAS, SRM6, 2xAC/2, 300XL, DHS Another quick and dirty build. Doesn't need Endo so you save a little cash. If C-Bills were no object I'd go back to Endo and get a bigger engine.
    Gaslight on
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  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    The other problem with dropping from a 300 to a 295 is you lose that extra heat sink slot in your engine. That's 3 free crit slots you could have on your mech somewhere else.
    mvrck.png
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  • Kaboodles_The_AssassinKaboodles_The_Assassin Kill the meat. Save the metal.Registered User regular
    Yeah, the extra heat sink slots is huge when running both DHS and Endo.

    You are running endo, right? If you've got the slots for it, then there's no reason not to throw it in.
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  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    Downgrading the Dragon engine was feasible prior to DHS and Endo. Now there isnt too much reason to.
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  • CampyCampy Registered User regular
    Really a dragon should have a 360XL in it. Then you get speed tweak. Then you laugh, and laugh and laugh and laugh. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH!
  • CarbonFireCarbonFire lasers pew pew pew Registered User regular
    Campy wrote: »
    Really a dragon should have a 360XL in it. Then you get speed tweak. Then you laugh, and laugh and laugh and laugh. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH!

    Though a 340XL is also acceptable, since you still go over 100 with speed tweak. Slightly less maniacal laughter, slightly more pew pew dakka dakka.
    Steam: CarbonFire MWO, Planetside 2, Origin: Carb0nFire
  • DaMoonRulzDaMoonRulz Registered User regular
    The most important thing to know is which variant of the Dragon you got
    damoonrulz_zpse43446fb.png
    "Democracy is based on the assumption that a million men are smarter than one man. How's that again? I missed something" Lazarus Long
  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    Campy wrote: »
    Really a dragon should have a 360XL in it. Then you get speed tweak. Then you laugh, and laugh and laugh and laugh. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH!

    i throw a XL340 into the Flame from time to time. But i like the extra firepower the XL300 affords it.
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  • DaMoonRulzDaMoonRulz Registered User regular
    Is there an updated roster?
    damoonrulz_zpse43446fb.png
    "Democracy is based on the assumption that a million men are smarter than one man. How's that again? I missed something" Lazarus Long
  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    DaMoonRulz wrote: »
    Is there an updated roster?

    forrrrr... what?

    people, mechs, batting lineup, enemas?
    n90uZGq.png
  • CampyCampy Registered User regular
    I run the standard flame build.

    STD300, 4ml, AC20. The STD is a bit wasted on the Dragon because of the lolhuge centre torso, but the AC20 is so worth it. I'd post my other Dragon builds, but I'm not at home and can't quite recall what I'm running at the moment.
  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    DaMoonRulz wrote: »
    Is there an updated roster?

    forrrrr... what?

    people, mechs, batting lineup, enemas?

    Who's next in line for the HGN-HM gauss enema?
  • DaMoonRulzDaMoonRulz Registered User regular
    Pilots.

    damoonrulz_zpse43446fb.png
    "Democracy is based on the assumption that a million men are smarter than one man. How's that again? I missed something" Lazarus Long
  • f3rretf3rret Registered User regular
    @Kaboodles_The_Assassin @fartacus I'm going to try the Crossfire things you've suggested. I've stopped playing for the last week or two because I don't like grinding along at 30fps when I KNOW I can get a solid 60, constantly.
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  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    XL 360 all day every day.

    Speed keeps you alive in a DRG, its extremely important to keep your speed as high as it can go.
    3ws6wAR.png

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  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    XL 360 all day every day.

    Speed keeps you alive in a DRG, its extremely important to keep your speed as high as it can go.

    speed is nice on a dragon and all, but not a complete necessity. im quite effective with triple ac2s and an xl300.
    n90uZGq.png
  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    BillGates wrote: »
    XL 360 all day every day.

    Speed keeps you alive in a DRG, its extremely important to keep your speed as high as it can go.

    speed is nice on a dragon and all, but not a complete necessity. im quite effective with triple ac2s and an xl300.

    I am not a fan of triple AC 2's on the DRG. Sure it does decent damage, but in the end all you're doing is poking armor.

    A DRG is designed to be a hit and run mech, something AC 2's just don't fill. Plus if you lose that arm you literally lose all your damage. DRG's arms are pretty easy to take off to, which is another reason for a high rated engine. Increased torso twist.

    BillGates on
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  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    BillGates wrote: »
    XL 360 all day every day.

    Speed keeps you alive in a DRG, its extremely important to keep your speed as high as it can go.

    speed is nice on a dragon and all, but not a complete necessity. im quite effective with triple ac2s and an xl300.

    I am not a fan of triple AC 2's on the DRG. Sure it does decent damage, but in the end all you're doing is poking armor.

    A DRG is designed to be a hit and run mech, something AC 2's just don't fill. Plus if you lose that arm you literally lose all your damage. DRG's arms are pretty easy to take off to, which is another reason for a high rated engine. Increased torso twist.

    i do admit losing that ac2 arm early in the match sucks, leaving you with 2 medium lasers. but lets face it, im doing something wrong if i lose my arms because it is not a front line build.
    im confident enough with my aim to put down a lot of hurt on the sections i need. its not pinpoint accurate, but it makes people get out of your way.
    n90uZGq.png
  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    BillGates wrote: »
    XL 360 all day every day.

    Speed keeps you alive in a DRG, its extremely important to keep your speed as high as it can go.

    speed is nice on a dragon and all, but not a complete necessity. im quite effective with triple ac2s and an xl300.

    I am not a fan of triple AC 2's on the DRG. Sure it does decent damage, but in the end all you're doing is poking armor.

    A DRG is designed to be a hit and run mech, something AC 2's just don't fill. Plus if you lose that arm you literally lose all your damage. DRG's arms are pretty easy to take off to, which is another reason for a high rated engine. Increased torso twist.

    i do admit losing that ac2 arm early in the match sucks, leaving you with 2 medium lasers. but lets face it, im doing something wrong if i lose my arms because it is not a front line build.
    im confident enough with my aim to put down a lot of hurt on the sections i need. its not pinpoint accurate, but it makes people get out of your way.

    I can see that build being a good support line build. AC 2's have good range. Didn't think of it in that role. I usually use DRG's as front line shock mechs.

    You see them, they alpha you, then they are gone.
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  • 3clipse3clipse Registered User regular
    3xAC/2 Dragon: the poor man's Bushwhacker.
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  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    3xAC/2 Dragon: the poor man's Bushwhacker.

    and its glorious!!
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  • KashaarKashaar Low OrbitRegistered User regular
    Details of the PPC nerf are up: Cooldown will be increased to 4 seconds, the rest stays as it is. Coming in the May 21 patch.

    Source
  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    CD of ER/PPC is not going to solve the problem. Just when i thought PGI was on the right track....sigh.
    3ws6wAR.png

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  • kaliyamakaliyama Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    CD of ER/PPC is not going to solve the problem. Just when i thought PGI was on the right track....sigh.

    Did you read the post?
  • KashaarKashaar Low OrbitRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Oh hey, he added a clarification that this is not intended as a nerf for poptarts, and that that's still being worked on. It's the same link as above.
    Forgot about the level of assumptions that would be made about the PPC change.

    Let me clarify, this is not a change to "nerf" boating/high alpha builds/"poptarting". It's a change to put the refire rate of the PPC back in line with the rest of the large energy weapons.

    Under investigation right now:
    To curb boating with high alphas... we are testing a system that induces a heat scale when firing multiples of the same weapon within a specific time frame. The more weapons fired of the same type, the higher the scale climbs.

    Possible internal damage on certain heat levels of the player's Mech. If you blast past your shutdown threshold and then some, you start to take damage internally.

    Investigation items are not locked in and are exactly that... thoughts and tests. Do NOT go flying off the handle about how this won't work or that won't work until we make an official post. It will severely help your blood pressure.
    Kashaar on
  • 3clipse3clipse Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    CD of ER/PPC is not going to solve the problem. Just when i thought PGI was on the right track....sigh.

    "Under investigation right now:
    To curb boating with high alphas... we are testing a system that induces a heat scale when firing multiples of the same weapon within a specific time frame. The more weapons fired of the same type, the higher the scale climbs.

    Possible internal damage on certain heat levels of the player's Mech. If you blast past your shutdown threshold and then some, you start to take damage internally.

    Investigation items are not locked in and are exactly that... thoughts and tests. Do NOT go flying off the handle about how this won't work or that won't work until we make an official post. It will severely help your blood pressure. "

    Oughta read the post before you comment >.>
    C2hmw6F.png
  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    One slight problem with this part:

    "Possible internal damage on certain heat levels of the player's Mech. If you blast past your shutdown threshold and then some, you start to take damage internally."

    Well...there goes my alpha weapon selection button on my Death Star. I'll just have to remember to make damn sure I have chainfire enabled on it.


    EDIT - on further reflection, it would be that in combination of their proposed solution to boating. Although, I suppose this means I'll have to retune my 4P to having a mix of medium and large lasers. Kinda wish I could rename it...I'm thinking "Disco Inferno"
    Erlkönig on
  • 3clipse3clipse Registered User regular
    I hope it's not hamfisted like that, because laser boats aren't broken but that will fuck them over.
    C2hmw6F.png
  • kaliyamakaliyama Registered User regular
    Some very old drinks recipes that were published in old FASA fiction and by a old friend and hardcore liaoist (reproduced in full at http://users.anet.com/~cplkagan/information/drinks.html).
    I have thought about making my own ERPPC recipe, but if it's at all loyal to the original it would probably kill you in one hit (much like a clan ERPPC will do to a cockpit in tabletop).

    Perhaps we can incorporate these into a MWO drinking game.

    PPC (from Warrior: En Garde)
    4 shots everclear
    1 shot of: peppermint schnapps (steiner)
    sake (kurita)
    ouzo (marik)
    plum wine (liao)
    bourbon (davion)
    tequila (davion, capellan march)

    Fusionnaires

    A Clan drink that is described as "...a blend so volatile that only warriors as defiant as freeborns would place it near their lips."

    4 1/2 oz lemon juice
    3 oz vodka
    1 1/2 oz peppermint schnapps
    1 1/2 oz lemonade schnapps
    1 1/2 oz rum

    Serve chilled in a tall glass over ice.

    [Note: This is also the recipe for a rather lovely ski resort drink called a "Back Scratcher" that I used to partake of way back when. It tastes like really strong lemonade with a kick.]

    (described in Bloodname and I am Jade Falcon by Robert Thurston

    Medium Laser

    1 1/2 oz gin
    splash of scotch

    serve in a chilled cocktail glass.


    Gauss Rifle

    1 oz light rum
    1/2 oz dark rum
    1/2 dash grenadine
    1/4 oz grenadine
    1/4 oz triple sec
    Pour ingredients into a tall glass and stir.

    [add a few silver dragees to the drink--they're those little BBs that you find with the cake decoration items at the grocery store. They look like tiny Gauss Rifle rounds. This is something I'd suggested to Marc and Stephane. --CK]

    Flamer

    1 oz cinnamon schnapps
    3 drops Tabasco sauce
    Add ingredients to a shot glass and stir.
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    While we wait for more official news on the matter, increasing the cooldown is a step in the right direction. That's an immediate reduction of DPS by 25% which, though it's a long way from solving the PPC issue, will certainly help when people close against PPC-users.

    Honestly, they should just throw the original values on there. With HSR and the new netcode, we're dealing with effectively an entirely different game where any of the current PPC balances, all made for the old game, are just completely irrelevant. Use the old values, see if it fixes the PPCs or makes them useless, then tweak from there. It would be infinitely better to have an OP weapon adjusted to useless and brought back to useful than keep it OP for another several weeks and adjust it.
    ninja-snarl_zps9453c54d.png
  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    double?...post?...
    BillGates on
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  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    BillGates wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    BillGates wrote: »
    CD of ER/PPC is not going to solve the problem. Just when i thought PGI was on the right track....sigh.

    "Under investigation right now:
    To curb boating with high alphas... we are testing a system that induces a heat scale when firing multiples of the same weapon within a specific time frame. The more weapons fired of the same type, the higher the scale climbs.

    Possible internal damage on certain heat levels of the player's Mech. If you blast past your shutdown threshold and then some, you start to take damage internally.

    Investigation items are not locked in and are exactly that... thoughts and tests. Do NOT go flying off the handle about how this won't work or that won't work until we make an official post. It will severely help your blood pressure. "

    Oughta read the post before you comment >.>


    The 2nd post was not posted when i read it, only the first one. But yes, I did read it.

    2nd post does do it's job of reducing blood pressure.
    While we wait for more official news on the matter, increasing the cooldown is a step in the right direction. That's an immediate reduction of DPS by 25% which, though it's a long way from solving the PPC issue, will certainly help when people close against PPC-users.

    Honestly, they should just throw the original values on there. With HSR and the new netcode, we're dealing with effectively an entirely different game where any of the current PPC balances, all made for the old game, are just completely irrelevant. Use the old values, see if it fixes the PPCs or makes them useless, then tweak from there. It would be infinitely better to have an OP weapon adjusted to useless and brought back to useful than keep it OP for another several weeks and adjust it.

    This is the wrong way to address the issue, they are trying to make a system to combat all future direct alpha weapons that are to powerful. If they are really messing around with heat levels and scaling based on the amount of concerning weapons you are carrying, this could potentially fix AC 20's as well. New weapons in the future could also be balanced based on this mechanic.

    It may take longer, but I think this is a better solution then just outright nerfing PPC's.
    BillGates on
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  • GaslightGaslight It's not your fault Video games are amazingRegistered User regular
    I think a slight heat increase might have been more appropriate but lengthened recycle time seems like a reasonable balance. They did kind of cycle crazy fast, faster than large lasers which already have to take a longer duration to fire.
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  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    That's a really good fucking logo TOG.
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  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    BillGates wrote: »
    That's a really good fucking logo TOG.

    I am slightly disturbed at what your choice of word order implies.
    mvrck.png
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