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Strip Search - Elimination #7

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  • parmeisanparmeisan Registered User regular
    I had originally made this statement in the above post:
    3clipse wrote: »
    "I mean, at that point you might as well say "really, Rob Liefield is just as good as Vincent van Gogh.""

    To someone, somewhere, this is a true statement (very probably to Rob Liefield).
    Apparently, Rob Liefield himself doesn't understand why he's still getting paid good money to make bad art.


    ... but I'm taking it into its own separate post because I had been planning on going back and finding the quote and probably rephrasing it. Not going to rephrase it now that I hit "post" and someone may already have seen the statement, but here's what I was referring to:
    In interviews, Liefeld has compared himself to other popular artists who experience meteoric success and acclaim early in their careers but near-pariah status afterwards, notably Britney Spears, who "became vapid in pop music, and perhaps I was nothing more than a vapid comic book artist." He seems to credit his success to tapping into the zeitgeist: "I'll be the first to tell you that we [the Image collective] were never the best artists. We were never the best at anything, but just like a song or a band or whatever, we caught on and we toured rigorously." [52]
  • goldwatchkillagoldwatchkilla Registered User regular
    I've disagreed with their choices in the past, but at least I understood why they selected the winner. This one really confuddled me. Just give the job to Lexxy so I can move forward in my life and stop enjoying a rigged show.
  • enderandrewenderandrew Registered User regular
    I have a question. I was told my interpretation was "bonkers". If that is so, then what is the purpose of the line "You should be grateful for this opportunity/the economy"?

    Or the line "this next job will be great"?

    My interpretation was that this dinosaur was rollerblading for their job as opposed to doing it as a passion project (competing for medals). And yet I was told that was a crazy interpretation. I think it is the only one that makes any sense logically.

    And while it is a more serious strip without a punchline, I don't think it is genius or particularly meaningful. Nor is it expressed well if people are unsure how to interpret it.

    In that sense, you can compare a moving comic and a funny comic and say one is better than the other in conveying its message.
  • ahdokahdok Figment of your imagination Registered User regular
    I can't believe people are still claiming the show is "rigged"

    If the creators wanted to rig this show for Lexxy, don't you think they'd have eliminated Tavis? the audience was split 50-50 on that decision, and it was clearly a close match. Nobody would have blinked at that. Eliminating Lexxy, and banking on a double "bad-comic" showdown would just be mad.
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  • RilsRils Registered User regular
    If it was rigged, when Lexxy was eliminated the first time it would have made life so much easier. The debrief in the car would have been "Sorry to put you through that, come back in two weeks and your office will be ready." Instead they threw her back in the ring to re-prove herself. That doesn't say rigged to me. That says they really like her and want to give her a chanec, but the ending is not a foregone conclusion.
  • goldwatchkillagoldwatchkilla Registered User regular
    Obviously it creates a lot more drama if someone is eliminated and then brought back unexpectedly. Classic reality tv show ploy, although the one brought back usually doesn't win it. My friend believed the whole time it was rigged for her to win, I was skeptical. However this last elimination kind of confirmed it for me, although I still like to believe it's any artists' game.

    On a separate note, does anyone have a link for a webcomic that Lexxy has done? I know she has one in development, but I would love to read her work.
  • NotaCylonNotaCylon Consultant - UN Las CrucesRegistered User regular
    I think the one observation from others so far that truly captures why I would have chosen Monica's over Lexxy's is the question "Which strip will I remember the longest?"

    Lexxy's was a good cartoon, but Monica's had poetry. Lexxy's made a joke, but Monica's tapped my humanity.


    ^^ Couldn't have phrased it better myself.
  • ZetaStrikerZetaStriker Registered User regular
    I definitely would've picked Monica's myself, but it's really hard to judge a dramatic comic against a humorous one. Monica made excellent use of imagery to tell her story, however, and that skill was something that mattered a lot more to me than another bombastic joke. A lot of people can be ridiculous, not many can tell a heartfelt story in a small amount of space with minimal dialog.

    Penny Arcade lost on this one.
  • fightinfilipinofightinfilipino legally competent Registered User regular
    it's like a ferris wheel in here. everyone's going in a circle.
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  • Anana11Anana11 Registered User regular
    Tense episode!
    On one hand, Lexxy's made me laugh right away. I admit to not getting the gist of Monica's until someone pointed out the narrative. I think I didn't catch the references to the past glories and therefore the ending didn't make as much sense. Going back to it now, I agree that it's a beautiful story. I don't think Mike and Jerry only want funny (they have plenty of serious strips in PA), but funny is what grabs them (mainly Mike). Thunderdome contestants who go for an interesting narrative (Mac, Lexxy's first comic, Erika, Katie's second comic, etc.) do not succeed unless the competition is weak.

    So, yay, Lexxy... well deserved. Monica, keep making comics!
  • enderandrewenderandrew Registered User regular
    @GOLDWATCHKILLA - Do you honestly believe that Mike and Jerry care more about drama than picking who they sincerely believe is the correct candidate in each elimination?

    Obviously Mike is toying with the strippers in the Thunderdome for some entertainment value, but it is clearly tongue-in-cheek. But when it comes to choose a winner, we've seen that he was emotionally affected by the realization he'd have to send someone home.

    He apparently takes this far more seriously that I think people realize. To suggest that he is dishonest in his statements and just picks whoever he wants to add drama is to call him a liar, and doesn't jive with everything we've seen from Mike and Jerry over the years.

    For better or worse, they're transparent, especially when they're imperfect.
  • MontyRohdeMontyRohde Registered User regular
    My two cents: It's easier to write a good gag comic than a serious one in 90 minutes. Especially given the fact that you can come up with a gag with nearly any two terms, but not a story.
  • SlothboySlothboy Registered User regular
    I didn't agree with the decision to bring Lexxy back, but in this elimination I do agree that hers was the better of the two comics.

    Monica's was good too but it took me too long to figure out what was going on. I don't mind puzzling over the significance of a comic, but I don't like having to read it twice just to understand the narrative. Boxes. dinosaurs. something about the economy.... what? I would say that the quality of her artwork was far superior but the flow wasn't nearly as clear.
  • parmeisanparmeisan Registered User regular
    I have a question. I was told my interpretation was "bonkers". If that is so, then what is the purpose of the line "You should be grateful for this opportunity/the economy"?

    I don't know about bonkers, but the interpretation I believe to be correct is that the dinosaur had found a job, but not one that used his roller-skating skills. This would explain why he was so sad and needed to be comforted, and why all the lights were already lit. It seems to me that he is sad that he can't make his roller-skating passion into a career, but decides that this doesn't mean he has to stop doing it altogether.

  • enderandrewenderandrew Registered User regular
    @PARMEISAN - The dinosaur seems unhappy in pulling their skates out of a box. Why? The implication seems clear that the dinosaur skated and won medals, but then stopped skating long enough to merit storing the skates in boxes.

    Then there is a mention of a job, and then we see the dinosaur skating late at night.

    If the point was as others have suggested that this is a deep, motivational comic about continuing to pursue your dream, why does the dinosaur seem so depressed about it?

    The dinosaur pulls out the skates and isn't happy about it. He is putting on the skates when he is told he should be happy about THIS JOB. Then he goes skating at night and doesn't seem happy about it.
  • PeterBmanPeterBman Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    The dinosaur seems unhappy in pulling their skates out of a box. Why?

    There's your problem right there. The dinosaur is actually putting the skates INTO the box.

    He was giving up on his skating dreams for a more steady job. Which is important to do given the state of "THE ECONOMY".

    So, you see him tossing and turning, hearing the voices of everybody telling him he's doing the right thing giving up the skating.

    But in the end, he's not ready to give it up entirely.
    PeterBman on
  • ahdokahdok Figment of your imagination Registered User regular
    it's like a ferris wheel in here. everyone's going in a circle.

    it's like a ferris wheel in here. everyone's going in a circle.

    http://www.socksandpuppets.com for comics, art and other junk.
  • ElbasunuElbasunu Registered User regular
    @PARMEISAN - The dinosaur seems unhappy in pulling their skates out of a box. Why? The implication seems clear that the dinosaur skated and won medals, but then stopped skating long enough to merit storing the skates in boxes.

    Then there is a mention of a job, and then we see the dinosaur skating late at night.

    If the point was as others have suggested that this is a deep, motivational comic about continuing to pursue your dream, why does the dinosaur seem so depressed about it?

    The dinosaur pulls out the skates and isn't happy about it. He is putting on the skates when he is told he should be happy about THIS JOB. Then he goes skating at night and doesn't seem happy about it.

    His new job is something other than skating, so he is unhappy.

    So he is skating at night to make himself feel better.

    The streetlights have nothing to do with anything, other than to show it is night.
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  • tastydonutstastydonuts Registered User regular
    @PARMEISAN - The dinosaur seems unhappy in pulling their skates out of a box. Why? The implication seems clear that the dinosaur skated and won medals, but then stopped skating long enough to merit storing the skates in boxes.

    Then there is a mention of a job, and then we see the dinosaur skating late at night.

    If the point was as others have suggested that this is a deep, motivational comic about continuing to pursue your dream, why does the dinosaur seem so depressed about it?

    The dinosaur pulls out the skates and isn't happy about it. He is putting on the skates when he is told he should be happy about THIS JOB. Then he goes skating at night and doesn't seem happy about it.

    idk, the boxes of medals made the line "You were serious about rollerblading?" line fall short too. At high level the comic is a good "never give up your dreams!" tale. But once you drop the altitude the logic starts to break apart.

    So just enjoy it for what it is.
    "a good leader can make an okay group great..."
  • parmeisanparmeisan Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    @PARMEISAN - The dinosaur seems unhappy in pulling their skates out of a box. Why? The implication seems clear that the dinosaur skated and won medals, but then stopped skating long enough to merit storing the skates in boxes.

    Then there is a mention of a job, and then we see the dinosaur skating late at night.

    If the point was as others have suggested that this is a deep, motivational comic about continuing to pursue your dream, why does the dinosaur seem so depressed about it?

    The dinosaur pulls out the skates and isn't happy about it. He is putting on the skates when he is told he should be happy about THIS JOB. Then he goes skating at night and doesn't seem happy about it.

    Well, I think he's putting the skates into the boxes, not taking them out. (In the third panel, he's not holding them. He takes them out again just before he goes out skating). And I think he's depressed because he hasn't decided yet in that panel that he can keep pursuing his dreams. He's listening to all the detracting voices saying that he should be happy for any old job, and you can't make a living as a roller-blader. But I'm perfectly content to disagree with you; you just were asking what the alternate interpretation was and nobody else was answering.

    EDIT: I can see how you might think he has put them on already for panel 3. But then he takes them off again? Maybe. But I still don't think so, and I still don't mind if you do think so.
    parmeisan on
  • miaAusamiaAusa GOD Gamer Of Daters ValhallaRegistered User regular
    I had a hard time watching that last elimination challenge, I really love both artist and it's been weird to hear what Monica had to say on the elimination stage, it was really random, then she was all sweet to them at the end, I never thought I would see that coming, I kinda felt bad for Mike, but I really love both artist.

    Here my take on the Dinosaur Rollablades, that was probaly one of the most awesome things they've pulled out so far, it's kinda based on an ending in Chrono Trigger done in the traditional 90 minutes

    BKTd1xRCQAA6ciY.jpg:large
  • NavyBeanNavyBean Registered User regular
    abby is so damn funny "we knew you won ... because you walked thru the door." too much fun!
  • empathempath Registered User regular
    Seriously? Even Mike got this high-concept one:

    The dinosaur has been a professional rollerblader, and achieved success (trophies)...but cannot support his family, and has to give his dream up to get a REAL job to 'pay the bills'.

    Thus he and his (wife? g/f?) are boxing up all his old gear and awards; she reassures him it's for the best.

    Then he's sleeping, and all the arguments that convinced him to give up rollerblading keep going through his head - all the 'give up your dreams and live in the REAL world'...

    ...and something snaps; he gets up, uncrates his rollerblades and goes out into the cool night to do what he loves, even if it cannot support them.

    It's poignant, and I've seen other poignant comics put up...and usually they don't win over a something with a laugh.

    I think it's beautiful - keep your dreams alive in SOME way, never give up on them totally - and touching, but yeah, it's not quite the 'gag' comic that Lexxy drew.

    To be honest, PA is looking for a style (as much as they can do poignant - automata, lookouts, etc.) that's "bread and butter" joke-a-day comix that keep the servers paid for, and foot the bills, etc.

    They were BOTH good...as always, and if *I* had to pick one, I'd be pulling my hair out.


    And holy ****, Monica! ^_^ The only thing she could have done to top that was to get up, walk over, put her finger over Mike's lips and say "Shhhhhh. Shhhhhhh." XD
  • akzelakzel Registered User regular
    I totally got Monica comics, and it was very clear to me, while Lexxy's strip was too silly for my taste, like, I didn't even smile… So I'm sad to see Monica go home and also very surprised that they needed to discuss her work to understand it.
  • JustTeeJustTee Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    JustTee wrote: »


    As for people saying that Lexxy's art looks unfinished - we now have two comics to judge her by. A lot of her shading and line work is similar between the two. I think it's pretty clear at this point that we can call it an artistic decision that you may or may not enjoy. But even within the same strip, her shading is consistently "incomplete", and characters are purposefully left not full. However, the lines that are there are clear, convey what they mean to convey. Her characters are shockingly expressive, and small details abound to add life to her figures. Look at the blood dripping out of the mouth of the T-Rex in the last panel. The hat popping off the T-Rex as it chases the camera-man in the background.

    Either you didn't read any of my explanations, or you didn't understand them. This is exactly what I explained. Her thunderdome art is extremely gestural... that is to say, conveying movement, form and emotion in a few simple lines rather than relying on contour. The point that some people are trying to make is that the thunderdome is the only time she seems to work this way. Comics she creates outside of the thunderdome have much cleaner line art, and are less gestural.

    Instead of examining the differences between two 90 minute strips, examine the differences between those strips and every other piece of art she has ever presented to the public as something other than a sketch, including her tumblr viral comics.

    It's obvious that, given the time, Lexxy often chooses to close lines and use gradients. Are you claiming that if Lexxy had more time, she would not have polished her thunderdome comics so that they more closely resemble her viral tumblr art?

    Some critics are saying that Lexxy chooses to prioritize other aspects of her art over techniques that are commonly associated with the kind of polish you see in print comics, and that her choice not to use gradients and closed lines are based on not having enough time. Some of the other artists work fast enough that they can make greater use of gradients, precise line art, hatching, or color in the time allotted. This does not mean their comics are necessarily better, only that they choose to work in such a way that they have time enough to employ these techniques that they know are often associated with polish. They manage their time differently. Not necessarily better, just differently.

    Personally, in Lexxy's first Thunderdome, I prefer her art to Tavis's piece. I think she makes good time management choices. That said, I believe that if she had 3 hours, she might choose to clean up her line art and put in some gradients. Do you disagree?

    Lexxy has said herself that when she saw Monica's comic, she thought she was going to lose. Why do you think that might be?

    I actually wasn't talking about you. You were arguing with someone else about the degree to which Lexxy's comics are polished or not. I think her gestural and emotive characters are an artistic choice, but it is certainly less polished than her other work.

    I objected, instead, to the use of the word "unfinished", as in, there were either mistakes or additional lines required to tell her story.

    If you look at both of her 90 minute comics, they both employ a very similar art style, with consistent artistic choices between them. I'm sure given unlimited time Lexxy may have changed her style. But maybe not. Maybe the point of these comics, for her, is to be free, fun, and gestural.

    The point I was trying to make was that Lexxy's art shows deliberate design choices, convey a lot of meaning without an overabundance of lines, and overall, never leave me with the impression that something vital is missing from the work. Therefore, it is as finished as art can ever be.

    Like you said - polished is a word that does not convey judgement. It is a statement used to compare varying degrees to which a drawing has been "cleaned up". That is not the word I objected to.

    Unfinished, however, is a word that conveys a value judgement. It says that the work is incomplete, inferior, and not able to stand on its own.

    The two words are not the same.
    JustTee on
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  • tastydonutstastydonuts Registered User regular
    Something that's unfinished is inferior and not able to stand on its own?

    Schubert's Symphony No. 8 in B minor, aka "The Unfinished Symphony" strongly disagrees with that assessment.

    But seriously, these walls of text must come down... :P
    "a good leader can make an okay group great..."
  • BeanchildBeanchild Registered User new member
    I don't understand the huge deal over either Mike or Monica's actions in this episode. They sniped at each other, and not all of the barbs hit home in a really funny way, but Mike/Jerry were deliberately sniping to get unsettled responses and they got them. They checked with her at the end to make sure it was okay, and Mike has posted on the main page that nothing she said offended or upset him in the least. So...why are we calling her a spoiled baby or Mike a bully? They're two people who had a sharp conversation with no hard feelings at the end. Am I missing something someone has done wrong? I don't even know what he was apologising for, honestly, and I'm glad she waved it off like the nothing it was.
  • mcpmcp Registered User regular
    Besides all that, "I want to fuck your mom" is basically a compliment.
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  • tastydonutstastydonuts Registered User regular
    mcp wrote: »
    Besides all that, "I want to fuck your mom" is basically a compliment.

    Unless she died in a fucking related incident.
    "a good leader can make an okay group great..."
  • HatTrickHatTrick Registered User regular
    I find it amusing that people are using Lexxy's Cloud Factory kickstarter as evidence that she must have lost at Strip Search or has already won.
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  • vidvid Registered User regular
    This episode makes it clear that the judging is severely weighted in favor of the comics having to end on a joke.

    I enjoyed Lexxy's comic, it gave me a chuckle, but it isn't something that I'm going to remember outside of the competition. Monica's comic elicited the greater response from me, even though it wasn't one based in humor. The imagery of putting away your dreams and accepting that you've got to take the more responsible route flies against the cliche of "follow your dreams and you'll succeed!" that often pervades entertainment media. Then to see him wake up, pull the skates back out, and go skating through the night (possibly the only time he has to enjoy his hobby) is powerful stuff.

    Monica earned that win, but Lexxy stole it away by knowing how to cater to the judges.
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  • JumbaJumba Registered User new member
    Monica's comic reminded me a lot of Dr. Doback's "Don't lose your dinosaur" speech from Step Brothers (and I mean that in a good way). In many cases I think "Strip Search" suffers from the same limitations as Top Chef .. they give the contestants less time than they may typically perform with, and they're called on to improvise on the spot.

    If Monica had more time and a chance to do a 2nd draft to tighten up the story line I think her comic would have been the best one seen yet.
  • CambiataCambiata I'm an alchemist and the beat is my base metal Registered User regular
    @foo I feel the same way about it as you, I just don't want to be too negative about Monica, whom I like. I even feel a little bad that Monica's comic didn't really move me, since it clearly did so many others. I, uh, don't even think the art is particularly good on that one. *hides behind a box*
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  • foofoo Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Yeah, to be overly clear I don't mean to reflect on her personally. She used that particular story hook to express herself personally, and I'm just not a fan of that hook itself, for reasons above.

    She's spontaneous, bluntly honest, fun, and funny, and I'm certain will be sorely missed in the house.

    And her art was very good in this strip. Huge quantity, lots of variety, and great use of greys at the bottom.
    foo on
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