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[Mechwarrior:Online] Weapon Rebalancing on the 21st. Oosik Sigs on P19

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Posts

  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    I can't say I agree with the idea of friendly fire not being configurable, but depending on the dynamics and chaos of actual games this may be something that can be adjusted to. Regardless I'd probably end up playing the deathmatch or other non-team modes whenever they are added, if they aren't already, so it isn't terribly relevant anyway.

    As far as tutorial stuff, yeh, I didn't exactly spend a huge amount of time in Google or youtube trying to reverse-engineer the game... it was more that after a few abortive attempts to play it I chalked it up to beta-ness and decided to wait. I imagine I will try to pick this up again when the new UI comes out and at that point I will do some research and try to learn all the buttons properly.

    Is there going to be a single-player campaign of any kind?

    It's a multiplayer-only game. They tried to get funding funding for a single player game originally, but no one wanted to invest in a single player MechWarrior, so they found someone to fund a F2P multiplayer game instead.

    Non-team modes are going to be a long way off(I think the devs said a Solaris-type mode is at least a year away). The focus of the game is going to be Community Warfare, which necessitates teams as you'll be fighting over territory.
  • Monkey Ball WarriorMonkey Ball Warrior A collection of mediocre hats Redmond, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Spectrum wrote: »
    Yes, sorry, when I say lobby, it's the client you have before you're actually in a game controlling a mech. Some things are still changeable when you're in-game by pressing esc->options, however.

    That was probably the source of a lot of my confusion, I thought that was a launcher, it certainly looks like a launcher, and launchers traditionally only have a launch button, maybe some patch notes, and a whole lot of useless junk like ads. I didn't look at the launcher/lobby/UI at all when I had the game installed.
    Syngyne wrote: »
    It's a multiplayer-only game. They tried to get funding funding for a single player game originally, but no one wanted to invest in a single player MechWarrior, so they found someone to fund a F2P multiplayer game instead.

    Non-team modes are going to be a long way off(I think the devs said a Solaris-type mode is at least a year away). The focus of the game is going to be Community Warfare, which necessitates teams as you'll be fighting over territory.

    That's somewhat dissapointing, though not unexpected. Still, for a free game it looks like there's a lot of potential. I just wonder how they expect to make any money, or if they even do expect to.
    Monkey Ball Warrior on
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  • SpectrumSpectrum Raising Heart Excelion, Drive Ignition! MidchildaRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Syngyne wrote: »
    It's a multiplayer-only game. They tried to get funding funding for a single player game originally, but no one wanted to invest in a single player MechWarrior, so they found someone to fund a F2P multiplayer game instead.

    Non-team modes are going to be a long way off(I think the devs said a Solaris-type mode is at least a year away). The focus of the game is going to be Community Warfare, which necessitates teams as you'll be fighting over territory.

    That's somewhat dissapointing, though not unexpected. Still, for a free game it looks like there's a lot of potential. I just wonder how they expect to make any money, or if they even do expect to.
    Microtransactions. You can currently pay for:
    1) The ability to own more mechs than just 4 through additional Mech Bays
    2) Special mechs only available through RL monies (translated to the currency of Mech Cash = MC), which have different hardpoints configurations or various other benefits over normal mechs, though thus far any advantage they have is fairly small
    3) Special one-shot consumables, though these are matchable through spending in-game currency instead
    4) Premium time, which offers faster generation of experience and in-game currency

    The best value is arguably the Mech Bays, though the Premium time can be very nice if you're just starting out. Some of the cheaper Hero mechs may be worth it depending on how much MC you have sitting around.

    edit: Whoops, sorry, forgot about
    5) Pretty color and camo. Colors are universal, camo patterns are by chassis
    Spectrum on
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Spectrum wrote: »
    The best value is arguably the Mech Bays, though the Premium time can be very nice if you're just starting out. Some of the cheaper Hero mechs may be worth it depending on how much MC you have sitting around.

    So many damn mech bays...

    AND MORE WILL BE PURCHASED.

    Though I will be clearing some space out soon. A lot of the reason I need so many mech bays is that I'm trying to skill up too many mech types right now, so I need all the bays to get them through the Basic levels. Can start ditching some when I get up to Elite, though, because I'll have plenty of mechs in the same weight class.
    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • Monkey Ball WarriorMonkey Ball Warrior A collection of mediocre hats Redmond, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    That's kind of foreboding. This kind of thing always rubbed me the wrong way, it's a serious issue in Diablo 3, though they managed to find a good balance in TF2, except I guess you still have to buy something to trade and stuff if you were not grandfathered in like I was. I really miss when you could just buy a game and have the whole game and that was it.
    Monkey Ball Warrior on
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    In the time periods when MWO is balanced and fun and stable, getting the F2P money to buy mechs isn't a problem at all unless you're completely addicted to assault mechs. I happily buy mech bays in the knowledge that each new bay is a new play experience.

    I've got two months of Premium time and have yet to feel compelled in the slightest to actually use it, because I can get everything I need out of normal play. I've got something like 20 mechs at the moment and I'd like to get 4-5 of them skilled up before getting anything else, which will keep me occupied for a while.

    MWO is the only F2P game I've ever played where a) the F2P part is not only kickass, but doesn't feel gimped at all in favor of premium players and b) has been (off and on) good enough that I would actually pay money to play it. I could likely only ever buy more mechbays and be completely happy with that, and I would only need the extra mechbays because otherwise I wouldn't have anything to do with the gobs of money I make from normal play. Basically, when the game is fun, the problem is that you'll have too much money from the F2P for the standard 4 mechbays to be enough, so the issue is that the game is essentially giving you too much stuff to do for people to be content with just 4 mechs.
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  • AvalonGuardAvalonGuard GO DIGITIGRADE OR GO HOME Registered User regular
    That's kind of foreboding. This kind of thing always rubbed me the wrong way, it's a serious issue in Diablo 3, though they managed to find a good balance in TF2, except I guess you still have to buy something to trade and stuff if you were not grandfathered in like I was. I really miss when you could just buy a game and have the whole game and that was it.

    Nah. Almost every bit of real money purchases in this game either make your mech look pretty or reduce grind. Nothing scary here.
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  • Stabbity StyleStabbity Style Walla Walla, WARegistered User regular
    Also, F2P really is the best thing that could have happened for multiplayer games. With a game that you have to purchase, there is always the risk of either never getting a player base established or the player base dying out a few months after launch when the next thing comes around. With F2P, you're able to remove that barrier of entry and sustain at the very least a small stream of new players checking it out. And you don't have to wrangle your friends into buying a game, it's just there, available to play.
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    Steam: stabbitystyle | XBL: S For Stabbity | MWO: stabbitystyle
  • Monkey Ball WarriorMonkey Ball Warrior A collection of mediocre hats Redmond, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money is not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.
    Monkey Ball Warrior on
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  • nonoffensivenonoffensive Registered User regular
    I miss the days when friendly fire was assumed. People didn't abuse it because some admin would actually blacklist you and sometimes it was just hilarious and worth a good laugh. People were civil to each other, and welcomed new players. I remember the first time someone talked crap when I tried to give them advice. When did we all get so angry... :(

    No room for fun anymore, just winning. I guess as long as the full game is hidden behind progression, and the only way to progress is win. You play to win because you literally have to win to play.
  • AvalonGuardAvalonGuard GO DIGITIGRADE OR GO HOME Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.
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  • XandarXandar Registered User regular
    If you like it you will spend money on bays just to have options of what to field. Then you'll have some extra money and branch out, color, camo, maybe a heroics if you find yourself loving a particular chassis.
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  • Monkey Ball WarriorMonkey Ball Warrior A collection of mediocre hats Redmond, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.
    Monkey Ball Warrior on
    [47 6F 6F 64 20 4A 6F 62 21 0]
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    Conversely, you also end up supporting a game that grows into far more than what it could have been if it had done the standard retail thing. All the other MW games were one-shot deals where you got a campaign and multiplayer mode, then expansions or sequels years later if the original did well.

    With MWO, they started at the core of the game (the combat), and are using the profit to expand the game more and more. Generally, MWO is much more enjoyable than the min-max silliness of all the previous games. If things go right, we'll also get a persistent metagame which is vastly superior to just jumping on a server with some other folks and shooting each other up.

    Paying into MWO at any level is basically paying to get a game which will do far more than any other MW game in making the whole thing an experience instead the exact same thing as every other MW game before it. Not to mention that there is zero pay-in required to play a bunch and find out if you like what the game is about, and you can get to an enjoyable level of gameplay fairly quickly.
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  • ElbasunuElbasunu Registered User regular
    I can see where you are coming from. I have the same "what should I pay for and how much" anxiety in F2P games.

    After this and planetside 2, I determined that since I at most, spend 30 dollars on a game, that I would spend 15 on MWO if it was fun.

    I sank 30 hours into it and said "Ok, here's 15 bucks for premium time and a mech bay". But I'm pretty frugal. Some people have different limits for what they'll pay for.

    So yeah, give it another shot, and if it's fun and you play a lot, spend money on what's important to you.
    Apyss-sig.png
    FYI: Image above links to my webcomic, and is (mostly) SFW. Steam ID: Obos Vent: Obos
  • nonoffensivenonoffensive Registered User regular
    The best way to play a F2P game is to just download the thing and play it. It's totally valid to just decide its not your thing and move on.

    I haven't paid anything yet and gotten an incredible amount of time out of the game. I can't say that I have had an optimal amount of fun, but none of the items for sale would appear to address that either. I'll be picking up some mechbays soon I'd imagine.

    Having to buy three mechs to have the one variant I want take advantage of the XP bonuses is my biggest annoyance followed closely by mandatory Double Heat Sink upgrades.
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    That sounds sort of ridiculous, you pay for what you want that you feel is a good value for the money you are giving. You support the F2P portion by playing the game and providing a player base for the game, so that people actually enjoy and play it and want to put money into it.

    I had the same argument recently with someone regarding MMO subscription fee's, where they said it was a ripoff because the total of all subscribers was larger than the cost of servers and infrastructure. I had to explain to them, that you only pay a subscription for what you feel has value, the provider making or losing money on your subscription should have no bearing on your decision to purchase. (Unless you are some sort of moneybags philanthropist).
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  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    @Monkey Ball Warrior does have a point, though: (I know this is the MWO thread...but the comic is relevant to the topic of F2P games in general) http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/6/10/
  • DelphinidaesDelphinidaes ~Shake Shake~ MWO:Endgame Registered User regular
    Erlkönig wrote: »
    @Monkey Ball Warrior does have a point, though: (I know this is the MWO thread...but the comic is relevant to the topic of F2P games in general) http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/6/10/

    It is a very valid point, and from the business perspective it is why it is such a lucrative model. They have a few different types of players:

    1) The player who will not spend a cent on the game.

    2) The player who will spend a little bit here and there but may take a few months to reach the cost you may normally associate with a new game.

    3) The player who will buy a lot of what the game offers.

    4) The player who buys everything the game offers.

    On 1 and 2, they lose money or break even. Those players are getting more time out of the game then money they are putting in (this is not a bad or good thing mind you it just "is")

    Player 3 is what they are expecting a lot of their playerbase to do. They want to incentivize what is offered and make a profit off of it.

    Player 4 is where they make up for players 1 and 2. What Player 4 purchases more than makes up for the lack of purchases on the other two. They don't need a lot of this player but every one of them they get is money in the bank. In an ideal world for them this is what they would want every player to be, but realistically that is not what happens.

    So long as they are offering stuff that people will buy on a regular basis they will make a good profit.

    This is why you see so many businesses adopting this model.


    From a player perspective you simply pay what you feel comfortable paying. If you think an alternate skin, or a pretty color is worth a few bucks, by all means go for it. If you feel it's not worth the price, then don't pay it and don't worry about it.

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  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    Spectrum wrote: »
    Yes, sorry, when I say lobby, it's the client you have before you're actually in a game controlling a mech. Some things are still changeable when you're in-game by pressing esc->options, however.

    That was probably the source of a lot of my confusion, I thought that was a launcher, it certainly looks like a launcher, and launchers traditionally only have a launch button, maybe some patch notes, and a whole lot of useless junk like ads. I didn't look at the launcher/lobby/UI at all when I had the game installed.
    Syngyne wrote: »
    It's a multiplayer-only game. They tried to get funding funding for a single player game originally, but no one wanted to invest in a single player MechWarrior, so they found someone to fund a F2P multiplayer game instead.

    Non-team modes are going to be a long way off(I think the devs said a Solaris-type mode is at least a year away). The focus of the game is going to be Community Warfare, which necessitates teams as you'll be fighting over territory.

    That's somewhat dissapointing, though not unexpected. Still, for a free game it looks like there's a lot of potential. I just wonder how they expect to make any money, or if they even do expect to.

    i would say exactly how much ive spent already, but lets just say i could have bought more than a few AAA titles. funbucks are the devil!
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    The way I figure it is this: I can easily justify spending as much on this game per year as I would on a single full-retail game, and that sixty bucks will go a really long way in this game the way I play. And if they offered a yearly subscription thing so that I could have year-round premium time for that sixty bucks with a little bit of premium money per month, I would probably snap that up in an instant.

    So far, I've got well beyond my money's worth for getting a Founder's package, with no regrets about it.
    ninja-snarl_zps9453c54d.png
  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    i look at this game as a hobby. i hop on vent, chat with the dudes, have a good time and toss some cash at it. it taken over all my other hobbies and eats up a good chunk of my dwindling free time. i dont mind tossing cash at a hobby.
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  • DelphinidaesDelphinidaes ~Shake Shake~ MWO:Endgame Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    i look at this game as a hobby. i hop on vent, chat with the dudes, have a good time and toss some cash at it. it taken over all my other hobbies and eats up a good chunk of my dwindling free time. i dont mind tossing cash at a hobby.

    Same here, I typically have one game that has a subscription or microtransactions at a time so I don't mind dropping a bit of cash now and then for silly stuff :D
    t7pXRdE.png
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  • HydroSqueegeeHydroSqueegee ULTRACAT!!!™®© Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    i look at this game as a hobby. i hop on vent, chat with the dudes, have a good time and toss some cash at it. it taken over all my other hobbies and eats up a good chunk of my dwindling free time. i dont mind tossing cash at a hobby.

    Same here, I typically have one game that has a subscription or microtransactions at a time so I don't mind dropping a bit of cash now and then for silly stuff :D

    this game is waaaaay cheaper as a hobby than my model trains. by far. even with the entire new pc it prompted me to replace.
    n90uZGq.png
  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    When/if I try it again, it would be my first F2P game other than TF2, which like I said doesn't quite count since I bought orangebox and got grandfathered in, and I am morally opposed to spending any more real world money on it. It is reassuring that spending real world money isn't not a requirement to enjoy the game, but then I have to wonder, if I end up liking it, would I feel compelled to buy something just to say thank you? F2P seems overly complicated.

    Well, your viewpoint is definitely different than mine!

    I find F2P incredibly straightforward. If I enjoy the game, I have a way to directly support it until the moment the servers die.

    I guess the sticking point is that "support" is not a binary thing anymore. With normal games, you either bought it or you didn't. With F2P, you could buy the cheapest thing, and you have then given some support, and then you basically have to decide how much support you want to give, but then the actual desirability of whatever it is you may or may not buy has distorted what would otherwise break down to a Pay What You Want system a la Humble Bundle. If you are not super careful (or if you are a kid and don't know any better), you might actually pay way more than any video game normally costs just because you wanted the stuff. It's the worst kind of slippery slope: The kind where you are broke at the bottom.

    But that complaint has nothing to do with this particular game, it's a complaint about the entire business model.

    i look at this game as a hobby. i hop on vent, chat with the dudes, have a good time and toss some cash at it. it taken over all my other hobbies and eats up a good chunk of my dwindling free time. i dont mind tossing cash at a hobby.

    Same here, I typically have one game that has a subscription or microtransactions at a time so I don't mind dropping a bit of cash now and then for silly stuff :D

    this game is waaaaay cheaper as a hobby than my model trains. by far. even with the entire new pc it prompted me to replace.

    It's definitely cheaper than shooting... the amount I've dropped on this game I could easily go through for ammo in a single month.

  • CycloneRangerCycloneRanger Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Saying that this game is cheaper than [expensive hobby] is not exactly going to reassure potential new players. A better angle would be "it's as cheap as you want it to be". There's nothing obviously pay-to-win yet.

    Also, a minor request: can we phrase the thread title in the form of "[Mechwarrior:Online] <something witty here>" so that I and others can recognize it in the long list of G&T threads? It's much easier to find the thread you want when the game name comes first, and most other threads do this already.
    CycloneRanger on
    MWO User Name: Gorn Arming
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  • SpoitSpoit *twitch twitch* Registered User regular
    Use the bookmarking feature to make threads stand out (and to use http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussions/bookmarked to only see the threads you care about)
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  • Stabbity StyleStabbity Style Walla Walla, WARegistered User regular
    Erlkönig wrote: »
    @Monkey Ball Warrior does have a point, though: (I know this is the MWO thread...but the comic is relevant to the topic of F2P games in general) http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/6/10/

    It is a very valid point, and from the business perspective it is why it is such a lucrative model. They have a few different types of players:

    1) The player who will not spend a cent on the game.

    2) The player who will spend a little bit here and there but may take a few months to reach the cost you may normally associate with a new game.

    3) The player who will buy a lot of what the game offers.

    4) The player who buys everything the game offers.

    On 1 and 2, they lose money or break even. Those players are getting more time out of the game then money they are putting in (this is not a bad or good thing mind you it just "is")

    Player 3 is what they are expecting a lot of their playerbase to do. They want to incentivize what is offered and make a profit off of it.

    Player 4 is where they make up for players 1 and 2. What Player 4 purchases more than makes up for the lack of purchases on the other two. They don't need a lot of this player but every one of them they get is money in the bank. In an ideal world for them this is what they would want every player to be, but realistically that is not what happens.

    So long as they are offering stuff that people will buy on a regular basis they will make a good profit.

    This is why you see so many businesses adopting this model.


    From a player perspective you simply pay what you feel comfortable paying. If you think an alternate skin, or a pretty color is worth a few bucks, by all means go for it. If you feel it's not worth the price, then don't pay it and don't worry about it.

    MWO makes it very easy to be somewhere inbetween 2 and 3. I've spent probably $125 on it so far. I don't own any hero mechs or camo patterns. And yet I've gotten great value out of that $125 (in my opinion). Considering how much time I've sunk into this game, that amount of money seem about right.
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  • Monkey Ball WarriorMonkey Ball Warrior A collection of mediocre hats Redmond, WARegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Back when I was, er "doing time", in WoW, it got to the point where I couldn't look at /played anymore, the numbers it showed were far too depressing. Similarly, I actively refuse to calculate exactly how much money I spent on that subscription and expansions over the years. I was going to say "DAAAAAMN" about spending $125, before I remembered this secret shame. Compared to that, $125 isn't so bad.
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  • DelphinidaesDelphinidaes ~Shake Shake~ MWO:Endgame Registered User regular
    Erlkönig wrote: »
    @Monkey Ball Warrior does have a point, though: (I know this is the MWO thread...but the comic is relevant to the topic of F2P games in general) http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/6/10/

    It is a very valid point, and from the business perspective it is why it is such a lucrative model. They have a few different types of players:

    1) The player who will not spend a cent on the game.

    2) The player who will spend a little bit here and there but may take a few months to reach the cost you may normally associate with a new game.

    3) The player who will buy a lot of what the game offers.

    4) The player who buys everything the game offers.

    On 1 and 2, they lose money or break even. Those players are getting more time out of the game then money they are putting in (this is not a bad or good thing mind you it just "is")

    Player 3 is what they are expecting a lot of their playerbase to do. They want to incentivize what is offered and make a profit off of it.

    Player 4 is where they make up for players 1 and 2. What Player 4 purchases more than makes up for the lack of purchases on the other two. They don't need a lot of this player but every one of them they get is money in the bank. In an ideal world for them this is what they would want every player to be, but realistically that is not what happens.

    So long as they are offering stuff that people will buy on a regular basis they will make a good profit.

    This is why you see so many businesses adopting this model.


    From a player perspective you simply pay what you feel comfortable paying. If you think an alternate skin, or a pretty color is worth a few bucks, by all means go for it. If you feel it's not worth the price, then don't pay it and don't worry about it.

    MWO makes it very easy to be somewhere inbetween 2 and 3. I've spent probably $125 on it so far. I don't own any hero mechs or camo patterns. And yet I've gotten great value out of that $125 (in my opinion). Considering how much time I've sunk into this game, that amount of money seem about right.

    Oh absolutely, those are all just examples. Realistically people don't fall neatly into each category. The overall idea though is that the people who pay more, more than make up for the people who play for free or for very little.
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  • Stabbity StyleStabbity Style Walla Walla, WARegistered User regular
    I don't really see myself buying anything else for a while until either they come out with some amazing cockpit items or do a 50% off Ilya sale. I have pretty much all the premium colors I really want (namely, Blood Orange and Titanium White) and I already have a cockpit poster/hanging item and a decent collection of dash ornaments. Maybe if they bring the Chinese lanterns back for cheap I'll get a couple more or come out with another hanging item that's actually cool, just so I can keep my Cicada-3M kitted out. Also, if they do another premium time sale, I'll get some. The 2 months I got have made me never want to go back. Also, when community warfare comes out, I'm sure there's going to be something along with it that'll be worth buying.
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Alright, just hit something that REALLY fucking pisses me off. When the fuck did Founder mechs stop counting as separate variants? Because I just finally got around to getting my Founder Jenner skilled up and it fucking turns out that the Jenner D I just bought to get a second chassis is completely redundant, so I literally just pissed away about 3.5 million credits on getting the new D and ES. What a stupid fucking change to make, if this is an intentional thing.

    EDIT: Definitely sent in a ticket about that. Never saw that change mentioned, ever, anywhere. Losing 3 million because PGI changed something non-obvious like that after several months of things being done a completely different way is just not cool.
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  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Welp, the "Soft Crash" they claimed to fixed, didn't get fixed.

    Edit- It does say "possible" so i guess theres that.
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  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Alright, just hit something that REALLY fucking pisses me off. When the fuck did Founder mechs stop counting as separate variants? Because I just finally got around to getting my Founder Jenner skilled up and it fucking turns out that the Jenner D I just bought to get a second chassis is completely redundant, so I literally just pissed away about 3.5 million credits on getting the new D and ES. What a stupid fucking change to make, if this is an intentional thing.

    EDIT: Definitely sent in a ticket about that. Never saw that change mentioned, ever, anywhere. Losing 3 million because PGI changed something non-obvious like that after several months of things being done a completely different way is just not cool.

    As far as I know it's been like that since the beginning. I never had an AS7-D(F) in my Pilot Lab, just an AS7-D.
  • Stabbity StyleStabbity Style Walla Walla, WARegistered User regular
    Alright, just hit something that REALLY fucking pisses me off. When the fuck did Founder mechs stop counting as separate variants? Because I just finally got around to getting my Founder Jenner skilled up and it fucking turns out that the Jenner D I just bought to get a second chassis is completely redundant, so I literally just pissed away about 3.5 million credits on getting the new D and ES. What a stupid fucking change to make, if this is an intentional thing.

    EDIT: Definitely sent in a ticket about that. Never saw that change mentioned, ever, anywhere. Losing 3 million because PGI changed something non-obvious like that after several months of things being done a completely different way is just not cool.

    Yeah, it's been that way forever. At the very least since launch of open beta. I can't speak for before that.
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    Alright, just hit something that REALLY fucking pisses me off. When the fuck did Founder mechs stop counting as separate variants? Because I just finally got around to getting my Founder Jenner skilled up and it fucking turns out that the Jenner D I just bought to get a second chassis is completely redundant, so I literally just pissed away about 3.5 million credits on getting the new D and ES. What a stupid fucking change to make, if this is an intentional thing.

    EDIT: Definitely sent in a ticket about that. Never saw that change mentioned, ever, anywhere. Losing 3 million because PGI changed something non-obvious like that after several months of things being done a completely different way is just not cool.

    Yeah, it's been that way forever. At the very least since launch of open beta. I can't speak for before that.

    Ugh, that is super-stupid. Founders were a separate chassis throughout closed beta, and there was no way to know that had changed until I just tonight decided to start skilling up Jenners. I don't even get why they would change that.
    ninja-snarl_zps9453c54d.png
  • SyngyneSyngyne Registered User regular
    Actually, poking around on the forums they apparently did show up as their own entry in the pilot lab during closed beta. I think the XP has always counted towards the base variant, though. I swear that was mentioned on the official forum somewhere. I'll have to see if I can dig it up.
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Syngyne wrote: »
    Actually, poking around on the forums they apparently did show up as their own entry in the pilot lab during closed beta. I think the XP has always counted towards the base variant, though. I swear that was mentioned on the official forum somewhere. I'll have to see if I can dig it up.

    If it's necessary to go dig through the forums for that change, that sort of thing is effectively the same thing as no notification at all. Yeah, Founders were entirely separate throughout the closed beta, which was when I actually regularly used the Jenner last.

    Dunno why they did the change, I just want my money back. 3.5 million completely lost because of a completely non-obvious in-game change is not fun. There wouldn't even be any way to tell without buying it and finding out the hard way, and why would I ever bother to check and see if they changed the status of Founder mechs from something they were for months?
    Ninja Snarl P on
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  • BillGatesBillGates Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Syngyne wrote: »
    Actually, poking around on the forums they apparently did show up as their own entry in the pilot lab during closed beta. I think the XP has always counted towards the base variant, though. I swear that was mentioned on the official forum somewhere. I'll have to see if I can dig it up.

    If it's necessary to go dig through the forums for that change, that sort of thing is effectively the same thing as no notification at all. Yeah, Founders were entirely separate throughout the closed beta, which was when I actually regularly used the Jenner last.

    Dunno why they did the change, I just want my money back. 3.5 million completely lost because of a completely non-obvious in-game change is not fun. There wouldn't even be any way to tell without buying it and finding out the hard way, and why would I ever bother to check and see if they changed the status of Founder mechs from something they were for months?

    They did the change before they wiped stats, it was one of the many reasons they did the wipe before the game went OB. So problems like yours are avoided.
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