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[League of Legends] : Awakening | Latin America servers on their way
Posts
I would have built a Runic Bulwark earlier, but I figured Galio had it and didn't notice he wasn't until too late.
I was playing Sona yesterday with an Ezreal. Ezreal stands there taking poke from MF, I spam W and summoner Heal to try and keep him up. They finally kill them:
"OMG Sona heal"
"Dude, I'm spamming it every time it's off CD, you are taking too much damage"
"Duh, of course I'm taking damage, I'm an ADC?"
Next I get killed, I buy a couple of items and I'm on my way back when I see him 1vs2 the other guys. He dies of course.
"Fuck you Sona why are you not here to heal me"
"I was coming back, you saw me dying, you saw the huge message at the top of your screen"
"OMG you are support you have to heal me!"
This is why I don't like playing support unless I'm forced to. I have no problem playing support with friends and I actually like not being a slave to last hits, but being support in soloq is masochism.
Are you like, sub 30 or bronze? Silver+ people call support all the time. There are like, support mains all over the place. I'd say I see people ask for support more often then jungle. In fact, 'anything but jungle' is pretty much what I usually hear. Which is good, since I prefer jungle. That is beside the point, though. I believe that even just in this thread, we have like.. 5 or so support mains who post regularly or somewhat regularly.
So I wonder where you get your metric, because there are even like a dozen supports in challenger at any given time. I know right, challenger tier support hax.
My Backloggery
How I like to handle these conversations:
"OMG Sona heal"
"k" MUTE MUTE MUTE
Challenger tier isn't really that relevant to how most people play the game.
Riot's even sorta admitted support sucks, but only in the most roudnabout ways, like "Buying items is fun," which, well, guess what fun you get to have the least of as 0 CS support (assuming a balanced game. Completing dunking on enemy bottom is fun, of course).
I don't have exact metrics on me right now, but I'd bet $100 in LOL gifts metrics say support is least preferred or 2nd least preferred role (jungle is also pretty unpopular).
Edit to add: Support and jungles also by far invite the most abuse.
"OMG, Sona, why u take kill?"
"Noob jungle no gank. BG BG BG BG BG."
Which is inevitable when your game systems have a setup of superstars and then customer service reps to help take care of them. It's not that dysfunctional with premades, of course, but pubs feel entitled to 0 CS whether you like it or not.
And hell, Riot had to clarify pick order vs. call order, partly because of legitimate disagreements, but partly because some roles are found consistently less fun in a way that makes that higher stakes than it ought to be. It's not like chocolate vs. vanilla ice cream, it's chocolate icecream vs. bread and water, so the possible contention is rather understandable.
That's one good solution. The other thing I like to do is play support Voli and call it a day. "No I can't heal you, shield you or clean your butt, I'll be here a-wardin', chillin' and pressurin', if you feel like killing someone tell me and I will flip them over".
When people on your team do the same thing over and over again that gets them killed. Not a similar thing - the exact same thing.
Bush off to the left of mid lane where Teemo always sits with a shroom, and I dunno, I guess Diana and Malphite were just magnetically attracted to it or something, because without fail they would respawn and walk over to the exact same brush every time and get killed every time.
Weeeeee solo queue.
It's perfectly relevant. It means that even at the highest tier of play, where people have practiced and played something for hundreds of hours and thousands of games often times... They are supports.
Let me say, there is no physical, mental or whatever way someone got 'bullied' into support for several hundred hours in soloq.
Also saying something is 'least preferred or 2nd least' is kind of throwing that net pretty wide considering there are only five 'positions' currently.
Dang I bet it fills two or these five slots definitely!
Also I tend to get a good few items as support.
But even if I don't because we need heavy wardage? Still more fun to outplay the other support. Since thats the entire purpose of a support, really, is the outplay the other people instead of bother with CSing.
My Backloggery
Back to Silver IV
Lawdy, let me tell you bout that creep score. Bouncing back and forth with a frozen lane, hitting 130 around the thirteen minute lordylord. And the kills oh I swear the kills, not even 10 at the 20 minute mark. Just a farmin and farmin in all the lanes. But then top and mid shove their lanes and let me tell ya, we got some dragons on top of it, lawdy their first dragon musta been at the 40 minute mark. And then, a miracle happened yes I swear, they engage a sightless baron, lose three people before they even know what's going on.
But there were dark times too yessir, a wipe in their jungle, and they get a baron. But excitement plays in our favor and they lose two exposed inhibs because I was close enough to their base. Then a shove up top and a win.
Well, I'll knock it down a bit: a legendary skin says first pick in ranked, if not traded, is less than 15% support. Nice and quantifiable, and even gives you a free 5% to play around with, where it could still be the least popular, but by a small enough margin. And I'm only really saying that because I want to win. I actually think it will be <12% or even <10%.
The important thing is to realize just because you like 0 CS doesn't mean the community in general does. They don't, because it's a shitty mechanic to have the least gold on your team by design, among other issues.
It's just that people don't understand support as that. For a lot of the player base support is the butt monkey whose only purpose is to bring greater glory to the ADC and use their measly gold to ward all the map. They are there to serve and treated accordingly.
If I could redefine the meta, I would make the laners' duty to ward their respective bushes, if you have a support and a jungles you have 3 solo lanes goldwise, there is no reason why they should not ward everything. Jungler could ward Baron and Dragon since he is moving around anyway and that's that, but having an already starved 0 CS support spend all gold on wards and sightstones is dumb when the cost of vision could be spread out among the laners, which won't take that big of a hit by spending 150 gold when they go back, and that way you get a 0 CS support who can still afford a couple of good items and be useful late game instead of a free kill.
Just because the general populace is a bunch of idiots obssessed with kda and carrying doesn't mean support is bad design. It gives a significantly different playstyle, which is incredibly satisfying to do well. Having the least gold is not a "shitty" mechanic, it's a strategy in which you attempt to focus as much of the team gold gain as possible into a few people as to make sure they grow strong enough to kill large parts of the enemy team. Hell, 0 cs support is not even a fucking mechanic at all, it's a tactical choice from the playerbase due to being a more efficient way to play. It also happens to be a large part of why the game is skillbased, having botlane be 24/7 sion/volibear or whatever the fuck you guys want it to be would be boring as shit. Now we instead get diverse matchups with a lot of strategy involved in picks, with the opportunity to run a kill lane if you really really really want dem sweet numbahs.
Saying "but people flame supports" is one of the most stupid statements I ever heard. People flame tops, people flame jungles, people flame mids. Idiots will always flame to blame their losses on anything else, if anything a jungler is then bad design since they take the blame 90% of the time instead of the support. So thus, remove the jungler, amirite?
Hell, you can compare it to healing and tanking in trinity style MMOs, something the general populace does not what to do since it entails responsibility. This doesn't mean they are bad roles, just that most people rather choose the easy road.
Do you think the chances of me finding smarter players goes up by playing draft? And furthermore, is it worth the wait time to get a game? I feel like draft mode would reward those who 'know' the game more with counterpicking and banning. I also want to get used to it pre-ranked.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Doug-1496/hero/22964679 - DH
Draft is just straight up more fun since you can ban out champs that are annoying to play against, and you usually get a better teamcomp. And you see what the enemy picks, so you can sometimes tailor your team to that.
I'm just going to mention that playing support on Dom is a hell of a lot more gratifying since you are a full strength player with full carrying capability and get to support even harder.
Supports in PG are basically royalty.
Supporting is still fun, just because you don't enjoy it doesn't make it a 'design flaw'. Just like how everyone may think Teemo's an asshole, doesn't mean Teemo's a design flaw. It's just a side effect of the game working as intended.
Also there's dominion characters to play that *aren't* Soraka, Nami or Leona? Lies and slander.
I assume bot games are absolutely not the place to go to learn support because of the AI, so solo queue and find the biggest non-idiot and stick to them?
Depending on your level there might not be any adherence to the meta enough to make supports work (because if you're supporting thin air it doesn't do anything).
Otherwise yeah, pick your support (but not Nunu, because you're a good person), go forth and proudly be the ward bitch.
Then treat every game of SR like you're playing Muder Bridge.
How do you build Nami on Dominion? Because I've consistently found her one of the worst characters to play on that map.
And support as a role is fine (says the support main), it just involves playing a very different game to every other position. Some people aren't going to like that game, some people are. Doesn't mean it's a broken role.
in my experience pretty much no one objects to giving a duo both roles in bottom lane because they're probably in voice chat and that communication is a big advantage
LoL: Nerf Love
Steam: TIFunk
The usual CDR/Mana stuff you do on non hard support Nami. Essentially her issue on Dominion comes from two places:
1) her ultimate cooldown is pretty large
2) she's absolute garbage 1v1 or even 2v2
The first one CDR solves and the second one is mostly about making sure you remember to stick with someone and try not to trickle into a point.
Her main strength on the map is her sustain and ability to posture at points both offensively and defensively. Bubble is terrifying, the slows on her auto attacks make running hard if someone over extends and tidal wave is great once a fight gets started.
She's definitely not the best, but she works well enough.
Naturally, once you hit 40%CDR you build iceborn guantlent, because it's baller as fuck.
start with normal games, tell them you're learning support, do your best, ask for advice (but take it with a grain of salt).
popular picks at the moment would be thresh and lulu, I guess nami and janna are viable as well.
To put you in the right mindset:
most of the adcs you will get are like adorable but utterly retarded puppies. They will go and urinate against a bear and look at it all cutey eye'ed wagging its tail, the bear won't care much and will try murder your stupid puppy. Depending on your support, you will be shielding your puppy (and pinging a retreat), turning the bear into something harmless, slapping the bear away or worst case scenario, dousing yourself in BBQ sauce and prancing around in front of the bear in the hopes that it decides to eat you.
To start out with learning a support, ensure your ward placement and map awareness are EXCELLENT. also, bush control is a further measurable action.
Basically, if you get ganked out of your tri bush or a lane bush, you've failed.
If you aren't putting some pressure on their adc or support and giving them control of the bushes leading your adc is getting zoned and not being able to cs, you've failed.
if you aren't pinging like a madman when hecarim comes charging through river in such a way that even the most tone-deaf, blind, moronic jizzrag would register it, you've failed.
yeah, start with that!
You'll have to pick a different support on Dom. Tresh and Nami are the very bottom of the list as far as champions worth picking goes. Tresh will never get to collect souls, and his cooldowns are brutal while Nami just isn't impactful enough with her cooldowns and her stun is hell on earth to land against speed shrine enabled targets.
That's so accurate it hurts.
Yeah, this is my experience with both of them. I was wondering if Albino was the fish whisperer or something and had figured out a way to make her work.
The only support I generally pick on Dom is Leona. Maybe Sona if I want to man up and power chord people in the face.
I actually laughed out loud at this.
I tried Nunu support about a month ago. I hated it almost as much as I hated myself.
BRB, playing game at shit tier match making to refute your points
Panth / Sion was pretty fun, yes. Or Taric / Urgot. Bottom lane used to have more variety than it does today. It's better than when 0 CS first become popular, at least.
Plus, it wouldn't be a warcrime to see Sona + Vayne, but have Sona gain enough benefit from gold that she wouldn't mind grabbing a last hit, or a champ kill.
Spoken like someone who has never been a raid guild officer. "Oh, let's delay the raid start for 30 minutes while I look for another healer, and finally I'll threaten to kill our shadow priest's dog / offer to suck his dick if he respecs to main heal." Nothing says good design like having to prostitute yourself to be able to play the game because no one likes to heal (well, my ex liked to heal, but fewer people enjoying healing than exist healer slots).
Edit: There is some hyperbole here, but was an issue from vanilla until I quit in Cata.
Disliking a specific meta which has not existed in the game the entire time is not "whining."
That said, I do play Dom because Dom is awesome and cool people play Dom.
This is in fact most players. It doesn't mean that a role not catering directly to those basic feedback methods is bad. It means the players don't resonate well with more subtle feedback of not dying to ganks, watching your carry wreck face and learning to be effective as the weakest member of the team late game. All those are really good feelings, just most of the player base doesn't like the role because they don't seem to understand it.
Now stop complaining about my stun bots, I like them where they are.
That and the "blame the healer" mentality is what makes being a support in soloq a terrible thing. Just because the meta works in professional, coordinated teams of non-jerkosaurus does not mean is adequate for other levels of play.
EDIT: I am not complaining about the existence of a support, I'm questioning the need for a 0 CS ADC babysitter on every game at every level of play.
Old Soraka's ult was a bit too good, but that sort of game swinging, "Fuck you, my AP is awesome," heal is what I'd like to see from support. I'm not saying support should be 1337 DPS, K/D whores, but merely that supports should become stupidly strong at supporting at high gold values. A high AP Janna shield should be stupid bullshit that people QQ about on the official forums, but we should ignore them, because high AP should make supports very powerful.
This happens so frequently that I don't like to play support. In that role more than any other you have to rely on a base level of competence of your lane partner.
But you are whining a fair amount about 0 cs support at the moment. Dom is fine for people who want to murder shit, and I realize it is supposedly deeper than that, and that's nice for the people who play it. If you really don't want to play support then don't. It's as hard as that. 0 cs support is a part of how the SR map is designed, and any change that got rid of it would make it straight up worse. And if you think supports aren't needed at your elo, you are free to play something else. People will rage, but people are dicks, so ignore them. You will most likely lose as well, since supports are just straight up better most of the time than whatever "fun" alternative you want.
Ironically, I was an officer in a raidguild, and I made sure we had healers. And I also respecced from shadow when needed to heal since I wasn't a huge asshole (respecs weren't that big of a deal in classic if guild paid for them). I choose to play with other not assholes though, so we narrowly avoided having to sell ourselves on the street apparently. Having certain roles contain more responsibility is not bad design, however much you seem to be afraid of it.
And well, the support meta is so much more fun than any of the other variations we've had. Opinions are fun.
Lol if you managed to lose with that team comp on aram you would need to turn in your lol badge and walk away from the game hehe. Ya sometimes the ARAM gods smile and you get some silly team like that.
I had one the other night where I was lux we had nidalee, heimer, alistar and blitz. It was just so silly I felt kinda bad for the other team but the ARAM gods are fickle and soon enough I will be on the receiving end of something like that.