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Nintendo decides it owns YouTube's Let's Play scene
Dusda
is ashamed of this postRegistered User regular
is ashamed of this postRegistered User regular
Apparently not content with the current muddled public image of the Wii U and it's perception among the general public as an accessory, Nintendo has decided to alienate Let's Players on YouTube by claiming ownership of their videos via Content ID:
http://www.destructoid.com/nintendo-is-claiming-ownership-of-let-s-play-videos-253793.phtml
Nintendo has issued a statement:
So, let's talk about how this could possibly be seen as anything other than a dick move.
http://www.destructoid.com/nintendo-is-claiming-ownership-of-let-s-play-videos-253793.phtml
The last time we heard about a major game publisher slapping the wrists of innocent YouTube channel operators, it was SEGA forcing the removal of videos that so much as breathed word of the Shining Force series. Whatever reason a company has for punishing fans who merely want to share love for their favorites games, I'm not buying it.
Now it's Nintendo with a shifty look in its eyes. Let's Player Zack Scott has taken to reddit, revealing that Nintendo is in the process of taking ownership of his gameplay videos, starting with LPs of Super Mario 3D Land. It's not a complete takedown as was the case with SEGA, rather an action taken via YouTube's Content ID system to redirect ad revenue to Nintendo's pockets instead of the video creator's. It's not an isolated event, either -- several other YouTubers have also confirmed claims against their own Mario-related game footage.
Nintendo has issued a statement:
As part of our on-going push to ensure Nintendo content is shared across social media channels in an appropriate and safe way, we became a YouTube partner and as such in February 2013 we registered our copyright content in the YouTube database. For most fan videos this will not result in any changes, however, for those videos featuring Nintendo-owned content, such as images or audio of a certain length, adverts will now appear at the beginning, next to or at the end of the clips. We continually want our fans to enjoy sharing Nintendo content on YouTube, and that is why, unlike other entertainment companies, we have chosen not to block people using our intellectual property. For more information please visit http://www.youtube.com/yt/copyright/faq.html
So, let's talk about how this could possibly be seen as anything other than a dick move.
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Nintendo isn't exactly in the wrong here. It's weird and all, but if it's their games (their copyrighted material) they can do this. I guess. I mean, I dunno. How bad is it really for an ad to appear at the start, or end, or beside another video? People generally hyper-react to advertising anyway. Maybe a chill pill is in order. Nintendo could've said, "Why are you broadcasting our material?" and have things removed. But they're leaving the content up.
The only people getting mad about this are people making dollars off this sorta thing. I think that anyone who is actually into promoting and celebrating a game / the company that made it are gonna be fine with this.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
*SHUT
DOWN
EVERYTHING
Videos of Nintendo content are going to be identified and the ads for those videos will be for Nintendo.
What's the fucking problem?
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
Plus at the moment for Nintendo, pissing off some of the people who are (maybe were at this point) your biggest defenders and evangelizers of your software and hardware is not exactly a very wise move currently. Quite a few of the bigger LPers are just straight up going "Have it your way Nintendo, we're not going to bother covering any of your games anymore".
Please tell me how Nintendo is preventing people from continuing to Lets Play Nintendo games. Because that isn't what this is about at all.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
Steam | Origin: MazPA | 3DS: 1848-2888-3654
Why would you bother with Nintendo when you can LP something else and get the revenue for it? Not to mention that Nintendo doing this makes it insanely easy for them to give out copyright strikes and without fail, the people doing these things absolutely fear copyright strikes on their accounts like nothing else. So they will simply stop doing LPs of Nintendo games (or even just Nintendo anything) and that's exactly what some of them are already saying they will do (EG: Northernlion).
No no no, stop right there - Where is anyone getting the impression that they are entitled to cash off other people's work? Yes, the commentary is yours, but in any industry when people are making material on top of some other piece of material the original material's owners need to give consent and are often paid for that material.
You have ignored Nintendo's statement about how they are NOT striking people on YouTube. If people are receiving strikes from Nintendo, people need to endeavor to remember that YouTube's copyright claim system does not require verification - a 14-year-old can claim to be Nintendo.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
You should totally be reading what I wrote the first time then.
Totally. Because I had a suspicion you didn't actually read what I wrote and you just had to go along and prove it.
So what? This is irrelevant because that's a primary concern that the vast majority of the LPer's effected in this debate have bought up - you should try reading what they are saying. Also you have to prove that 14 year old claiming to be Nintendo wasn't Nintendo, not the other way around (they have to prove they are Nintendo). Once you get a strike, it's almost impossible to actually remove it and this new set up makes it very easy for them to give out said strikes.
Edit: And I just checked, this isn't actually true when it comes to advertising. That has to come from the actual owners of the content.
I do disable AdBlock on some sites. My point was, there's probably a pretty large overlap between people who extensively watch LPs and people who use AdBlock, i.e. the hardcore / geek crowd.
The amount of money "lost" this way is probably negligible.
Steam | Origin: MazPA | 3DS: 1848-2888-3654
And hell, Sega's actions about Shining Force are still way more aggressive and wrong than this Nintendo thing could ever be.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
While the copyright holders have the right to clamp down on this stuff, I don't think it's a wise business decision. They are free to do so however.
That is the most compelling showcase of the Wii U I've seen, anywhere, and I think JonTron and Egoraptor deserve to be paid for it. Sure, Grumps are pretty much the cream of the crop; there are lots of LP channels that are basically 95% raw Nintendo game footage with little effort by the channel owner, but so fucking what? Does Nintendo seriously think they're losing revenue to people watching hours of some dude playing Super Mario 3D Land on YouTube? Who do they think watches this stuff?
That makes Lets Players who decide this the idiots, not Nintendo. Because they are protesting... nothing.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
Also yeah Henroid, if you're a lets play producer who focused on Nintendo games (like well... a lot of pokemon lets players) this is a pretty obvious thing to pitch a fuss about having that revenue stream taken away. Most lets plays may be tatty rubbish I wouldn't watch but there's more than a few that put genuine time and effort into their work and it seems a shame that Nintendo is trying to take away what little they get back from that effort.
Not really. That's pretty much the best thing. They've found a way to make a bit of pocket money off producing entertainment works that would otherwise never exist.
Perhaps the fact that people have a negative reaction to advertising shows that maybe it isn't as neutral as you think? Doubly so as scholarship on the matter is strongly against the idea of advertising as benign.
Let's Play are free advertising for a product in an entirely different genre of work (Youtube videos as opposed to interactive video games), and frankly, if our IP laws were better, it would be protected explicitly, as it's more akin to a review than Harry Putter and the Wizard's Stone, which is something that IP exists to legitimately prevent.
This is a huge dick move.
It's entirely possible they merely want to cover actual costs like FRAPS, a microphone, etc, rather than cackling evilly over their ill gotten gains.
Again, how was it ever their money to be making in the first place?
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
If no, then there is no issue. Odds are great that Youtube put an ad before your video anyways. Now it's a Nintendo ad. Boo frickidy hoo.
If yes, then congratulations on getting this far in life profiting on the works of others. You knew it had to end sometime. Be thankful your "product" is still being allowed to exist, when they have every intellectual property copyright law to take your video showing their complete product in full and nuke it from orbit.
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In the 'not being a dick' world? Yes, it's pretty fair to get some pocket change from you-tube ads.
The main point I'd make is why Nintendo would do this. Yes it's full with in their rights to do so but it just seems like a kinda pointless middle finger to fan communities more than anything else.
How is it not? I'm trying to understand the logic here. They're making these videos with their own time and money, essentially providing free advertising for Nintendo and Nintendo doesn't have to provide a cent or move a muscle. if I was Nintendo I'd be thanking the big Let's Players for featuring their products.
This move by Nintendo probably doesn't mean much (it's not a catastrophe), but it feels kinda unnecessary and counterproductive
Currently playing: DI:Riptide, Eador:MotBW, FE:A, MH3U
Of course. I know I was interested in a couple of games, watched an LP of them, decided that that was all the enjoyment I needed / wanted out of that product, and didn't end up buying it.
Steam | Origin: MazPA | 3DS: 1848-2888-3654
The middlefinger is to leeches, not to fans.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
"Hey remember when we acted like know-it-alls with a control obsession that alienated people with decisions that had very low chance of being beneficial to us anyway? Let's that."
Because Nintendo is only profitable due to government subsidies (also known as "IP laws"), and considering the US Constitution has IP law as explicitly "to promote the useful arts and sciences," it stands to reason that in a world in which large checks weren't cut directly based on passing laws to favor private profits over the public arts, it would be considered a morally and legally reasonable thing to do in which one makes a transformative work of art in an entirely different entertainment medium, that otherwise would have never been made (Nintendo isn't being cut out of their own Let's Play profits here).
Let's Players are harming no one, but producing social value, so they absolutely deserve to be compensated, if people are willing to do so.
why wasn't it?
....
see, you are doing the thing a lot of people do when trying to defend media rightsholders: making a moral claim about policy, then circling around to the policy as a justification of itself.
people should be able to make whatever piddly amount of money they're making from let's plays because let's plays are cool and we should want as many of them to be created as possible. It also strikes me as kind of amusing that a company that has put more thought into the non-visual parts of the experience of playing video games than probably anybody would think that LPs are some kind of substitute.
but what really weirds me out about this is that nintendo thinks it's worth it. Like, whatever small number of ad exposures you get out of this kind of thing can't be worth pissing off your enthusiast base, can it? Especially since anybody looking up an LP of your stuff is probably already a fan.
my unofficial autobio will be accompanied with tips on how to smile
cause I've found that when they don't see you frown, they never know that you're a threat
and they don't sweat you when you came around
Once you start making money off of it, it falls into new exciting categories.
Steam | Origin: MazPA | 3DS: 1848-2888-3654
You don't buy games. You do not own a single video game. No one does.
You license video games.
The best part is the hubris LPers are having about their protest. "NO MORE FREE ADVERTISING FROM ME." Have fun with that I guess. Nintendo games aren't going to nosedive in sales.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013
It means nothing to Nintendo. Edit to add: It's not impossible, and perhaps even likely, that LPs do produce tangible returns to Nintendo like any other similarly sized, not free marketing effort. Though I do imagine that traditional, high expense marketing dwarfs that for the most part.
"For you, the day Bison graced your village was the most important day of your life. But for me, it was Tuesday."
Posting a Let's Play on the net, wherein a person plays and shows the entirety of the game, in full, to viewers for free, who watch it and then never need buy the game because they've already seen and experienced everything said game has to offer: Total fair use.
Purchasing a used video game played by somebody else for $10 cheaper, of which none of that money goes to the publisher in any way: Horrible blight that is ruining the industry in every conceivable way.
I can only assume people who are defending the rights for Let's Play's also have zero issue with the used market. Because otherwise in what hypocritical world do you live in where I can watch a complete playthrough of Gears of War, start to finish with all cut scenes included and that's OK... but the second I attempt to buy that game used and pick up a controller, I'm a filthy person who's destroying the game industry?
I like Let's Play's. For games I own and have played, it's a new perspective. For games I don't, it's a way to experience them, especially with games I otherwise have no other way of doing (because I can't/don't want to pay $Texas for the system and game, depending how old they are).
Nintendo isn't even removing or restricting them, even though they could if they really wanted to be evil dicks and would be in the legal right to do so. Instead they're just putting a Wii U commercial before it.
Pokemon Black code - 3009 7390 5907 Send PM if you add me
Rifftrax is an audio recording that sits ontop of an existing movie. Rifftrax does NOT own the movie, nor do they have the rights to reproduce or distribute the movie. But because the movie is more or less the same when played on any device, they can make a living off of providing audio commentary on top of the movie.
Lets Plays are literally Rifftrax for video games. The difference is that the recording, in this case, is a live recording of -their- playthrough, because everyone's playthrough will be different.
But here's the thing: Few Lets Players I've seen (with the exception of Giant Bomb and sometimes they even push it) gets permission to rebroadcast content. Game Grumps has gotten a couple of exclusive sponsorships, where they probably shared the ad revenue. But.. yeah.
Nintendo, for well over a decade, at this point, has stated (in multiple places) that they own all rights to the characters, images, sounds, gameplay, code, and redistribution rights for their works. Why is it surprising that they are actually executing those rights?
And what makes you think, for a second, that other companies won't do the same thing? Again, Sega set the precedent. Sony's probably going to run with it, what with the built-in "Share" button of the PS4 likely uploading the data to Sony-owned servers where they control the revenue stream. I wouldn't put it past Sony to block all streaming that doesn't go through the share button either.
As I said in the Industry thread, I've always been leery of Lets Plays of games newer than a few months/a year. It just struck me as weird that they'd basically be releasing a full playthrough of the game without needing to actually buy/play the game. How does that help the developer/publisher? There will be anecdotes of people buying/not buying a product based on an LP, but I'm willing to bet the majority of people aren't running out and buying something based on what they saw on the Yogscast.
But at the end of the day, this is Nintendo's copyright. Call it a PR blunder if you want, but I think very, very few people are even going to notice.
NNID and many other services: Athenor or Myridiam // 3DS: 3883-5283-0471
Let's describe Rifftrax accurately. Rifftrax is essentially a podcast commentary for a film that you have to play at the same time as a film you are able to view on your own. Rifftrax does not contain the film content. They are perfectly fine to do this.
Unmotivate - Updated May 17th - "Let's Complain About Nintendo"
The PA Forumer 'Lets Play' Archive - Updated March 25th, 2013