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[Dota 2] Yep, still in beta.

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Posts

  • P10P10 Registered User regular
    Wards are unpurchasable for non-'support' heroes. It can't be done.
  • sparklesparkle Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    valiance wrote: »
    mts wrote: »
    man had the best encounter yesterday. i head into a match and wait like 30-40 seconds to see what people pick, and since only one person immediately grabbed QoP, i hit random and get weaver. 4th person to pick grabs centaur and last is ursa. so great another pub 4 carry game. anyways i had said i was going to go bot since qop was going mid and Centaur ends up going to my line. so we are laning and he is totally screwing with my last hits, but eventually i figure out what he is doing and start getting them. he starts pinging like mad and says some garbled thing which i figure out means he doesn't want me last hitting. i continue to last hit from him, because you know, weaver. and he is like i get the last hits, you don't attack the creeps since he was the tank and I was support. I am like umm, no I'm not. and he gets all pissy and reports me and then calls me nub.


    good times in pubs

    this is the fundamental problem with (pub) dota, and possibly the role design of the game in general. Noone wants to NOT get last hits, noone enjoys NOT having items or gold, noone likes giving up kills and dying for teammates. Reminds me of MMOs where noone wants to be the healer, only worse, since at least the healer is allowed to have gear and gold, and get experience.

    There are people who enjoy the support role (I myself enjoy it from time to time), but generally noone is going to want to get less farm so some random incompetent pub can get more.

    i'm fine with supporting as long as the carry doesn't suck. My last game was pretty rough. Tough to support a Jugg that buys soul ring and has no idea how it actually works. I was a little hesitant about the solo-queue only matchmaking mode, but not after that last game (they were a 4-stack with 1 decent player).
    sparkle on
  • ProspicienceProspicience The Raven King Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Jutranjo wrote: »
    Dyrwen66 wrote: »
    Some days I dream of a time when wards would be cheaper if you had "support" in your role name. But, alas, that'd be broken.

    That's a stupid idea. Alchemist/sven/naga siren can't support anymore? Or does everyone get this support in their role name and the price of observers is reduced by 50 from 200?

    Whoa man, no need for the "stupid idea", get those ants out yo pants and read the bold'd.
    Prospicience on
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  • king awesomeking awesome Registered User regular
    The whole ward thing is so crazy in pubs sometimes. I routinely buy wards if I'm mid. I'll get bottle first (if applicable) then wards. Helps me not die, helps me get runes, and let's the sidelanes ward up the enemy jungle or lane ward so they don't get shit on instead of warding only the rune spots.

    It's 150g, that's fucking nothing, and what it gets you for the duration is insanely good.
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  • AuralynxAuralynx Registered User regular
    In the field of "infuriatingly weird games," I grabbed Shadow Demon earlier and got sent to mid on a team with Elder Titan and Nightstalker. We also had a Sand King and a Lich, or something.

    I proceed to start off reasonably well for having to lane against TA including a good spree-breaking kill early (certain individuals paid my missing calls and wards no heed). Through midgame I am successful enough at making people's lives difficult, then at about 30 NS just stops fighting their carries. Ever.

    By the end of the game he had a scepter and part of a BKB for "damage." I was very sad.
    Playing in:
    World's Largest Dungeon 4E as Torbera
    BSG Exodus Game 17 as Tom Zarek
    Twilight Imperium Game 7 as Muaat
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    The whole ward thing is so crazy in pubs sometimes. I routinely buy wards if I'm mid. I'll get bottle first (if applicable) then wards. Helps me not die, helps me get runes, and let's the sidelanes ward up the enemy jungle or lane ward so they don't get shit on instead of warding only the rune spots.

    It's 150g, that's fucking nothing, and what it gets you for the duration is insanely good.

    yea i usually grab wards if i am playing an invis hero and things are getting rough., but i may just start grabbing wards for mid when i do play that
    camo_sig.png
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    mts wrote: »
    The whole ward thing is so crazy in pubs sometimes. I routinely buy wards if I'm mid. I'll get bottle first (if applicable) then wards. Helps me not die, helps me get runes, and let's the sidelanes ward up the enemy jungle or lane ward so they don't get shit on instead of warding only the rune spots.

    It's 150g, that's fucking nothing, and what it gets you for the duration is insanely good.

    yea i usually grab wards if i am playing an invis hero and things are getting rough., but i may just start grabbing wards for mid when i do play that

    It's a must if they are throwing pudge mid.


    gamertag: Canadianllama
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    sparkle wrote: »
    valiance wrote: »
    mts wrote: »
    man had the best encounter yesterday. i head into a match and wait like 30-40 seconds to see what people pick, and since only one person immediately grabbed QoP, i hit random and get weaver. 4th person to pick grabs centaur and last is ursa. so great another pub 4 carry game. anyways i had said i was going to go bot since qop was going mid and Centaur ends up going to my line. so we are laning and he is totally screwing with my last hits, but eventually i figure out what he is doing and start getting them. he starts pinging like mad and says some garbled thing which i figure out means he doesn't want me last hitting. i continue to last hit from him, because you know, weaver. and he is like i get the last hits, you don't attack the creeps since he was the tank and I was support. I am like umm, no I'm not. and he gets all pissy and reports me and then calls me nub.


    good times in pubs

    this is the fundamental problem with (pub) dota, and possibly the role design of the game in general. Noone wants to NOT get last hits, noone enjoys NOT having items or gold, noone likes giving up kills and dying for teammates. Reminds me of MMOs where noone wants to be the healer, only worse, since at least the healer is allowed to have gear and gold, and get experience.

    There are people who enjoy the support role (I myself enjoy it from time to time), but generally noone is going to want to get less farm so some random incompetent pub can get more.

    i'm fine with supporting as long as the carry doesn't suck. My last game was pretty rough. Tough to support a Jugg that buys soul ring and has no idea how it actually works. I was a little hesitant about the solo-queue only matchmaking mode, but not after that last game (they were a 4-stack with 1 decent player).

    That's the worst. God help you if you say anything about it in chat, or suddenly it's a 4 man dog pile on you for daring to ask the Jugg what he's doing.

  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    I've been warding when I was playing as Lich the past few days. My problem is I'm new at it and even though I've read some guides, I never get feedback from teammates.
  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    Teammates feedback about wards is usually "why the hell aren't you warding" after they get caught pushing the lane on the opposite side of the map from me.

    Or people who rush into the area where my ward just dropped and we saw the enemy enter. They also tend to give "feedback" about wards!
    SC2EU/US: Frozenzen.437 Steam: Frozenzen
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    BlazeFire wrote: »
    I've been warding when I was playing as Lich the past few days. My problem is I'm new at it and even though I've read some guides, I never get feedback from teammates.

    Really, for beginners you just want to make sure the 2 rune locations are covered. More advanced stuff can be gleaned by watching what other players do, or watch pro games. A good rule is that if no one yells at you, you're probably doing things right.



  • Foolish ChaosFoolish Chaos Registered User regular
    So, I've got about 150 games under my belt. About when can I expect people to start acting appropriately in lane?

    Just about every single game I play, my lane-mate just never stops auto attacking creeps, regardless of role. I'm no expert, but I dont see how that shit helps anyone.

    I mean, I at least understand a person stealing LH from their carry. They want some sweet items. But non-stop auto attacking I don't understand at all.
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    Hell...I'm around 450 wins and I still randomly get people doing that once in awhile. I think I saw things even out around 200 wins though. I hover around a 50% win/loss rate for reference.
  • khainkhain Registered User regular
    The number of games has absolutely nothing to do with the skill bracket you play in, but to answer the question, never. Even in very high there are a considerable number of terrible players. I think a large cause is that currently the spread for matchmaking seems pretty wide.
  • sparklesparkle Registered User regular
    BlazeFire wrote: »
    I've been warding when I was playing as Lich the past few days. My problem is I'm new at it and even though I've read some guides, I never get feedback from teammates.

    there are plenty of guides that list good rune spots, but none of them tell you when to place a ward in those spots. I've found that you should try to have a goal for the next 5 minutes, and ward with that goal in mind. And think of the goal for the enemy team, and ward there as well. For example, for the first 10 minutes, you want your mid to have control of all the runes and to spot ganks coming, so you ward up the river. After that, you might want to push down a particular tower (or towerdive a lonely carry), so you put 1 ward behind the tower and another watching areas where the enemy team might come through to backstab you. If you have a tower that is at half health or less, then you know an enemy is going to try to finish it off soon. You may TP in to defend it, and having wards further down the lane would tell you whether its safe to chase them.
  • Page-Page- Registered User regular
    As much as my blinding hatred for all things Valve prevents me from doing anything but froth violently at the mouth when I think about what they've done to my beautiful game, I have tried to pitch in on the dev forums, specifically with feedback.

    Right now we have a completely superfluous commend system and a stupidly automated report system. The commends are superfluous because they do absolutely nothing for either the person giving them out or the person receiving them. So I suggested that commendations get a feedback box just like reports do, so that at least the person receiving them could have some small idea of what the hell happened, and not just notice 3 weeks later that they've got 1 more commend in a nebulous category without ever knowing why, or even when, they got it. I also think people should be able to see their reports, or at the very least be able to see which games they were reported for. Of course this was met with a faint chorus of mehs and Valve doesn't respond to anything so whatever.

    (I also said they should make the spirit bear skill icon select the spirit bear for spectators and I'll be godamned if that ever gets implemented.)
    (Mostly) Competitive Gaming Blog Updated May 3rd. Ramblings!
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    Thanks for the comments re: warding. Warding runes and pinging them when they come up has been most of my focus. I'll keep your idea of goals in mind sparkle. I think maybe the randomness of PUGs makes it a bit harder to decide what to do.
  • AuralynxAuralynx Registered User regular
    I'm apparently in High pretty consistently of late and I still get Support Banes who can't figure out that if they'd weakness Mirana they (or, you know, me on Lifestealer) could get last hits without getting clobbered, people who random and get someone they never play and decide to roll with it, and so on.

    Sometimes you get a guy who goes Godlike with Skywrath in the first 20 minutes, as well. It is always a new experience.
    Playing in:
    World's Largest Dungeon 4E as Torbera
    BSG Exodus Game 17 as Tom Zarek
    Twilight Imperium Game 7 as Muaat
  • Minerva_SCMinerva_SC Registered User regular
    I fuggin LOVE playing support in dota. I love playing heroes like bane/lina/witch doctor/jakiro/disruptor, ect, who are awesome supports but are also capable of getting plenty of kills and farm when a carry isn't around. I love stacking creep camps and dewarding and being aggressive with harassment in lane. The only problem with this is, when I do play carries, bad supports stick out like a sore thumb and it become incredibly frustrating.

    I can't wait for Abbadon. He's the king of dick suipports.
    "If a cherry pie filled cape is wrong, I don't want to be right.
    I'm dead serious."
  • valiancevaliance Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    So, I've got about 150 games under my belt. About when can I expect people to start acting appropriately in lane?

    Never. I mean that seriously. Never. The varieties of the idiocy might change, but people will never ever get it right. Maybe at some skill level they learn not to autoattack, but then they'll learn to do something else idiotic. Your teammates will never reliably be competent. Not in High, not in very-High, not EVER. (and if you can't spot the idiot, its you)

    ---

    Early on aside from the runes, the next biggest ward spots early on are in the neutral camps to stop pulling. Less popular (but still pretty useful) is warding your safelane by the ramp to the river. I also like warding the offlane jungle to detect ganks, but there usually aren't enough wards for that.

    Later on think about the plateau by the hard camp in the enemy jungle (both jungles, particular when T2s go down), the middle of the jungle by the magic bush (radiant) or the ramp up to the dire jungle by their T1. Also the raised area by radiant easy camp can be a good midgame spot.
    valiance on
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  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    Minerva_SC wrote: »
    I fuggin LOVE playing support in dota. I love playing heroes like bane/lina/witch doctor/jakiro/disruptor, ect, who are awesome supports but are also capable of getting plenty of kills and farm when a carry isn't around. I love stacking creep camps and dewarding and being aggressive with harassment in lane. The only problem with this is, when I do play carries, bad supports stick out like a sore thumb and it become incredibly frustrating.

    I can't wait for Abbadon. He's the king of dick suipports.

    This is my problem.

    I love playing support, it has a much more macro feel to it. You plan out when and where you're team will need vision, blocking pull spots, dewarding when you think the enemy has vision. Plus there are plenty of supports whom can still score kills and assists without requiring the gold of constant lasthitting. However, 7/10 when I play a carry, my supports don't do anything.

    It is impossible to stress this enough. Games are lost and won on vision. Warding is king.
    korrasig2.jpg
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    a few recent tourny matches with a slark in them., first one went well, see how mouz does with him. lumi just said he has 100% win rate
    mts on
    camo_sig.png
  • AuralynxAuralynx Registered User regular
    mts wrote: »
    a few recent tourny matches with a slark in them., first one went well, see how mouz does with him. lumi just said he has 100% win rate

    Slark is just vile if he gets on a tear among us mere mortals, and he's got a great skillset for the pro style of play. Should be fun to see how they do.
    Playing in:
    World's Largest Dungeon 4E as Torbera
    BSG Exodus Game 17 as Tom Zarek
    Twilight Imperium Game 7 as Muaat
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    Then you get single drafts where everyone decides to go carry, I go support lina vs a whole team that has Riki and everyone has shadow blade yet your team refuses to buy sentry wards.

    gamertag: Canadianllama
  • AuburnTigerAuburnTiger Registered User regular
    Got new Nature's Prophet mythical taunt. Of course, equipping it crashes the game for everyone.

    I suppose I could wait until it's obvious we're going to lose, then equip it. The ultimate deny.
  • JJJJ Registered User regular
    Didn't know you could equip things mid game.
    Mr. Banballow was so badly maimed, he turned into a hideous monster, oozing and bleeding, snarling and growling like a beast---enraged and bent on revenge. He tracked down the kids responsible for the fire and killed them one by one----with a blowtorch. That wasn't enough for Banballow. He won't leave his inn or his memories, so there he waits....in ambush....
  • AuburnTigerAuburnTiger Registered User regular
    JJ wrote: »
    Didn't know you could equip things mid game.

    Yep; takes effect after you've died then respawned.
  • sparklesparkle Registered User regular
    mts wrote: »
    a few recent tourny matches with a slark in them., first one went well, see how mouz does with him. lumi just said he has 100% win rate
    i think na'vi lost with him yesterday.
  • AuralynxAuralynx Registered User regular
    Got new Nature's Prophet mythical taunt. Of course, equipping it crashes the game for everyone.

    I suppose I could wait until it's obvious we're going to lose, then equip it. The ultimate deny.

    I unboxed and equipped the Axe one today, is this a known issue across all of them? Would explain the trouble I had getting a game started earlier.
    Playing in:
    World's Largest Dungeon 4E as Torbera
    BSG Exodus Game 17 as Tom Zarek
    Twilight Imperium Game 7 as Muaat
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    I hear it's all the new taunt's. I would hold off equipping them.

    gamertag: Canadianllama
  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    I think Treant Protector might be a bit OP, His heal is pretty much gg midlane. I just helped a antimage dominate mid against a rubick...
    Sicarii on
    korrasig2.jpg
  • milskimilski Registered User regular
    While your assistance no doubt helped, I don't think Rubick is necessarily the strongest midlaner. An AM playing aggressively can probably run him out of mana long before Rubick is remotely threatening. Still, Treant also means that AM takes no damage or recovers from those trades, which certainly doesn't hurt.
    Steam ID: Milski
  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    milski wrote: »
    While your assistance no doubt helped, I don't think Rubick is necessarily the strongest midlaner. An AM playing aggressively can probably run him out of mana long before Rubick is remotely threatening. Still, Treant also means that AM takes no damage or recovers from those trades, which certainly doesn't hurt.

    Rubick is actually a fairly strong mid laner, I believe Dendi ran a competent mid Rubick during TII if bat and ta were banned.
    korrasig2.jpg
  • sparklesparkle Registered User regular
    Rubick was nerfed after TI2. Not a lot mind you, but then again, Invoker had a pretty minor nerf as well, and look at what happened there.

    Anyways, I don't think Rubick has a big edge on AM 1v1 with or without the treant armor.
  • Ratsult2Ratsult2 Registered User regular
    Auralynx wrote: »
    Got new Nature's Prophet mythical taunt. Of course, equipping it crashes the game for everyone.

    I suppose I could wait until it's obvious we're going to lose, then equip it. The ultimate deny.

    I unboxed and equipped the Axe one today, is this a known issue across all of them? Would explain the trouble I had getting a game started earlier.

    I have the spider shuffle and as soon as I click Play after hero selection I get a connection issue. Problem was solved by unequipping it, so all taunts seems to cause it.
  • TheGerbilTheGerbil Registered User regular
    I got the mythical doom sword. It doesn't say it has a custom animation but he holds it very different in the preview than any other sword. I wonder if its a bug (probably).
  • nealcmnealcm Registered User regular
    yeah i don't think rubick is often played as anything but hard support lately
    19ZUtIw.png
  • TheGerbilTheGerbil Registered User regular
    TheGerbil wrote: »
    I got the mythical doom sword. It doesn't say it has a custom animation but he holds it very different in the preview than any other sword. I wonder if its a bug (probably).

    Turns out he just holds it funny when you view him via picking or equiping items, no change to animation with the mythical doom sword.
  • FerrousCranusFerrousCranus Registered User regular
    I hope that new pose isn't accidental, cause it looks badass. The sword also seems to give him a special 'stabby stabby' attack animation.
  • Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    Sicarii wrote: »
    I think Treant Protector might be a bit OP, His heal is pretty much gg midlane. I just helped a antimage dominate mid against a rubick...

    I played a game with him last night. Maxed living armor first; they didn't take a tier 1 tower until past 30 min, and they only ever got the one. Living armor might be op, yeah. But he falls off really hard late game, AND there is a way to counter the armor early. You go push and dedicate serious man power to taking down towers, cause if you don't, you'll never get them and the enemy team will have a massive early game vision and gold advantage.

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