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[Iron Man 3] is out now! Man of Steel coming soon.

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  • BlankzillaBlankzilla We were the best, Richard No matter what they sayRegistered User regular
    Langly wrote: »
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Uh
    the whole point of the movie was Avengers fucked up Tony's entire worldview and he has PTSD and is forced to rethink his entire life.

    That is why it is different from the previous two.

    I will say about IM3
    That I thought afterward it seemed a little weird to single out the New york event and the wormhole in particular as being the thing that gives him PTSD.

    Like, the previous movies had given him just as much life threatening scenarios, namely being blown up, tortured and trapped in a prison cave, seeing a friend murdered, being attacked and almost killed by your family friend and partner, having plasma whips nearly kill you in a race car, etc.

    Like, I mean I guess the aliens present something different, but when it comes to traumatic, violent events, it just seems kind of all the same. He has almost died lots of times. I can buy him reacting the way he does, but to point to a single event seems strange.
    He almost got trapped in a hostile alien dimension carrying an active nuke after trying and failing to contact the woman he loves.

    And this is like maybe 24 hours after finding out that aliens exist and right after pulling borderline suicidal tactics fighting them alongside a Norse God.

    It is a pretty unheard of and fucked up scenario.
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  • JoolanderJoolander Registered User regular
    Langly wrote: »
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Uh
    the whole point of the movie was Avengers fucked up Tony's entire worldview and he has PTSD and is forced to rethink his entire life.

    That is why it is different from the previous two.

    I will say about IM3
    That I thought afterward it seemed a little weird to single out the New york event and the wormhole in particular as being the thing that gives him PTSD.

    Like, the previous movies had given him just as much life threatening scenarios, namely being blown up, tortured and trapped in a prison cave, seeing a friend murdered, being attacked and almost killed by your family friend and partner, having plasma whips nearly kill you in a race car, etc.

    Like, I mean I guess the aliens present something different, but when it comes to traumatic, violent events, it just seems kind of all the same. He has almost died lots of times. I can buy him reacting the way he does, but to point to a single event seems strange.

    I think its
    really the first time since the cave that he had no idea what to do. We see a very similar Tony in that cave talking to Yinsen.

    Now there's aliens and rage monsters and guys with actual super powers and freaking Viking Gods, is Tony still relevant? We know the answer is "yes," but in Tony's eyes, he has always been THE BEST, period! He's always had to fit in a world of normal people, and now for the second time in his life, he doesn't have all the answers
  • ToxTox I kill threads Let Piggy Chimp decideRegistered User regular
    Also the thing about Avengers that "changed things" is that he know longer knows what to expect. Part of what made him so successful was being able to examine a situation and know what to do. Aliens? Wormholes? Gods? He didn't even know they were possible six months ago, how is he supposed to account for that?
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Langly wrote: »
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Uh
    the whole point of the movie was Avengers fucked up Tony's entire worldview and he has PTSD and is forced to rethink his entire life.

    That is why it is different from the previous two.

    I will say about IM3
    That I thought afterward it seemed a little weird to single out the New york event and the wormhole in particular as being the thing that gives him PTSD.

    Like, the previous movies had given him just as much life threatening scenarios, namely being blown up, tortured and trapped in a prison cave, seeing a friend murdered, being attacked and almost killed by your family friend and partner, having plasma whips nearly kill you in a race car, etc.

    Like, I mean I guess the aliens present something different, but when it comes to traumatic, violent events, it just seems kind of all the same. He has almost died lots of times. I can buy him reacting the way he does, but to point to a single event seems strange.
    the difference I think was that ot wasn't about him. It wasn't a fight it was a war. [/s]
    nightmarenny on
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  • CenoCeno Chumble spuzz. Registered User regular
    Speaking of Avengers, Joss Whedon is on twitter officially now for those who do such things.

    His handle is JossActual.
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  • DE?ADDE?AD Registered User regular
    This whole discussion reminds me of one of the shining good points in ASM - there's an early scene where he taunts a bully into attacking him instead of another student.

    Even without the powers, dude was Spider-Man.

    The powers just let him be Spider-Man effectively.
  • WeaverWeaver Cap'n NEW CRUNCH CITYRegistered User regular
    Like you don't already know the next time Tony shows up he's gonna be full
    Extremis armor non-prototype version or something closer to Bleeding Edge
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  • Xenogear_0001Xenogear_0001 Registered User regular
    Tox wrote: »
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    Centipede Damascus wrote: »
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    Exactly. I beg to differ. I think that's a silly thing to say. Otherwise, why did they make the story in the first two movies about him designing, wearing, and using the suit to achieve things he couldn't otherwise accomplish?

    because he is Iron Man

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    Look, Iron Man is who he becomes when he puts on the suit. If he were Iron Man when he wasn't in the suit, he wouldn't need the suit. Clearly, he needs the suit. Even in this movie! He couldn't have accomplished what he did without the suits. Hence why he was trying to get the one he had left working through much of the movie (nevermind the basement full of them). I take issue with this statement because it's stupid on its face.

    I get that he's trying to say something like 'I have the heart of a hero, I am Iron Man!'. That's great--he still needs the suits. Sorry.

    THE WHOLE POINT OF THE MOVIE IS THAT
    HE DOESN'T NEED THE SUIT TO BE IRON MAN. HE BUILT THE SUIT BECAUSE HE IS IRON MAN, NOT HE IS IRON MAN BECAUSE HE BUILT THE SUIT.

    So the lynchpin of the movie is he internalizes his hero-identity? Great. I still maintain that the next time a super-powered villain comes crashing down, he's going to want a suit to jump into.

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  • Xenogear_0001Xenogear_0001 Registered User regular
    masterofmetroid wrote: »
    Remember that sequence in the movie where he
    just goes into a hardware store, buys some shit, and manages to use it to infiltrate a heavily guarded compound until he meets an enemy he couldn't even beat WITH the armor?

    Wasn't that sequence fucking rad?!

    I maintain he'd have had a better chance with the suit. I mean, he did prepare first, right? He did assemble something approximating what his suit would be capable of first? Yeah.

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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    And he'll have one. Because he isn't in a christopher nolan movie
  • JimothyJimothy Registered User regular
    He even says so early on to Pepper:
    "You experience things and then they're over and you still can't explain them"

    Tony Stark is not a person whose worldview allows for things he can't explain

    And "aliens" is a pretty monumental thing for anyone in the entire world to deal with, let alone someone who was most in the thick of it. We made first contact, and what's more is that it didn't go so well. That really does change everything, and in a far more substantial way than anything that happened in the first two IM films.
  • Bluedude152Bluedude152 Registered User regular
    Did you miss the majority of the movie he spent kicking ass while outside a suit?
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Weaver wrote: »
    Like you don't already know the next time Tony shows up he's gonna be full
    Extremis armor non-prototype version or something closer to Bleeding Edge

    A bunch of people have been talking about how happy they are that wasn't in im3.
    which I can't help but laugh at because I'm sure they are saving Tony's body suit for avengers2.
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    masterofmetroid wrote: »
    Remember that sequence in the movie where he
    just goes into a hardware store, buys some shit, and manages to use it to infiltrate a heavily guarded compound until he meets an enemy he couldn't even beat WITH the armor?

    Wasn't that sequence fucking rad?!

    I maintain he'd have had a better chance with the suit. I mean, he did prepare first, right? He did assemble something approximating what his suit would be capable of first? Yeah.
    The movie never claims otherwise. That's why they say you've misinterpreted it. The end is not "and now I will stop using those stupid suits".
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  • Theodore FlooseveltTheodore Floosevelt w o r s h i p c a t g o dRegistered User regular
    SirEtchwarts wrote: »
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    masterofmetroid wrote: »
    Remember that sequence in the movie where he
    just goes into a hardware store, buys some shit, and manages to use it to infiltrate a heavily guarded compound until he meets an enemy he couldn't even beat WITH the armor?

    Wasn't that sequence fucking rad?!

    I maintain he'd have had a better chance with the suit. I mean, he did prepare first, right? He did assemble something approximating what his suit would be capable of first? Yeah.

    And the reason he could do all of that is because he was Tony Stark, and Tony Stark is Iron Man.
    and in making this point, xenogear, it is not also saying "the armor is worthless"
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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    So I watched the Thor 2 trailer

    Anyone think this is going to end with Thor staying on earth?
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    Wait, I thought Iron Man was Tony Danza.
  • TrippyJingTrippyJing hot hot hot hot stayin' alive stayin' aliveRegistered User regular
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    NOTE: Reposted from Movies thread--this seems more on topic here.

    I really, really wanted to like Iron Man 3. And while viewing it, I enjoyed it, so there is that. But upon reflection, there were some problems that emerged:
    -Why did Pepper not have her own armor? Shit, they did this in the comics so it's not without precedent. They even get her in Tony's at one point! I think that would have been a much better direction to take things in.

    -Tony's armor(s) seem(s) to switch back and forth between being made of glass and metal. And the ending? He couldn't get out of each suit fast enough. No consistency. And then Iron Patriot was giving the baddies all that trouble when they were trying to breach it. It almost felt like, when the suit was actually there (real prop) it was solid seeming, but as soon as it switched to CG, it became super fragile again. Just, ugh.

    -So... he had all those suits down in his basement the whole time? I guess they were still being assembled or something, though? That whole thing was super fast and loose. Felt too obviously like a Deus Ex Machina moment and rubbed me the wrong way.

    -Now Tony's remote controlling his suits? That's just... disappointing. And defeats the premise of Iron Man.

    -The panic attacks were not written well. I just didn't buy them.

    -Dat kid. Is he comic relief or is he someone we should be sympathizing with? Pick one. I mean, the kid did fine. Tony's banter with him struck the wrong chord, though. It wasn't cute--Tony was just being a douchebag, and not the kind that you like either.

    -That brings me to my next point: Tony felt schizophrenic in this one. Just... not as cohesive, character-wise. I can't quite put my finger on it. And he came across as more asshole-ish this time around--like, a little too much in that direction for my tastes.

    -So... when did the bad guys get remote control over the Iron Patriot? Isn't that the kind of system Tony had to design his suit from the ground up to implement? And isn't the Iron Patriot just a re-painted War Machine (old tech)? It seems like putting the President into War Machine would be the kind of plan that might backfire. And yet it didn't.

    -Pepper has Extremis! Cool beans! Oh, wait, that's a problem or something, so mumble, mumble she's better now!

    -That pesky shard of metal near my heart? Hell, let's just get it out of there, nbd! Boy, I wonder why I never did this in the first place!

    -"I am Iron Man, with or without my armor!" Nope, you're just Tony Stark without the armor, bud. Why the fuck would you let a woman convince you to destroy your work? Especially when it's single-handedly responsible for saving New York from nuclear obliteration? Seems a bit necessary to me.

    I guess I had more problems with it than I realized.

    A lot of those seem less like problems and more like I WISH THEY DID THIS
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  • JoolanderJoolander Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    nightmarenny wrote: »
    Weaver wrote: »
    Like you don't already know the next time Tony shows up he's gonna be full
    Extremis armor non-prototype version or something closer to Bleeding Edge

    A bunch of people have been talking about how happy they are that wasn't in im3.
    which I can't help but laugh at because I'm sure they are saving Tony's body suit for avengers2.

    I still really hope they don't
    have that liquid metal suit that pours out of his bones. If they manage to make it feel right, great, but right now I just don't see how that wouldn't change his character from "guy who builds his own super powers" to "guy who built a thing that gave him super powers"
    Joolander on
  • The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    Melding wrote: »
    Wait, I thought Iron Man was Tony Danza.

    no

    tony danza is the garbage picking, field goal kicking philadelphia phenomenon
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  • UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Chareth Cutestory Lawyer of the SeaRegistered User regular
    Why is Paul Giamatti in his boxers
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  • AntimatterAntimatter I remember touch I need something moreRegistered User regular
    UnbreakableVow wrote: »
    Why is Paul Giamatti in his boxers

    he's been pantsed
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  • nightmarennynightmarenny Registered User regular
    Related to this discussion im3 was originally titled "the iron man" after the way tony had been anthropomorphizing the suit. After seeing the movie I think it pretty clear what a brilliant title that would have been.
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  • UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Chareth Cutestory Lawyer of the SeaRegistered User regular
    Antimatter wrote: »
    UnbreakableVow wrote: »
    Why is Paul Giamatti in his boxers

    he's been pantsed

    That was my first thought, but

    He's just kinda scarily flexing at Spider-Man after being pantsed?
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  • SirEtchwartsSirEtchwarts Edward Kenway's yer man. Arg, Swashbuckle, Avast, etc.Registered User regular
    Antimatter wrote: »
    UnbreakableVow wrote: »
    Why is Paul Giamatti in his boxers

    he's been pantsed

    I just want to say how wonderful it is that Spider-Man appears to have pantsed someone in a blockbuster movie
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  • RenzoRenzo Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Tony
    blowing up the suits was symbolic. It represented Tony realizing that he can handle whatever comes at him. He built the suits because he was so freaked out by the events of Avengers, and he couldn't sleep, and he turned his insomnia and panic into just building a fuckload of suits just in case another alien invasion or who knows what else happened. He was hiding behind his suits. At a few points (talking to Pepper remotely and saving Air Force One people), he's literally hiding behind his suit.

    So he realized he didn't need to do that anymore. That's also why he
    removed the shrapnel.
    He's done using crutches or making excuses to Pepper.

    That doesn't mean he's not going to use a suit.
    He's just not going to be insane about it like he was at the beginning of the film.
    The last line of the movie is still
    "I am Iron Man."
    Renzo on
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  • Theodore FlooseveltTheodore Floosevelt w o r s h i p c a t g o dRegistered User regular
    TrippyJing wrote: »
    Also
    Why is everyone saying Clean Sweep? I thought it was Clean Slate.

    easy to mishear, but I'm pretty sure it's Slate
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  • AntimatterAntimatter I remember touch I need something moreRegistered User regular
    i think something that could lead people to be frustrated with tony is that
    he did need all those suits to save the day
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  • Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    LTM wrote: »
    SirEtchwarts wrote: »
    LTM wrote: »
    Chincymcchilla wrote: »
    Xenogear_0001 wrote: »
    NOTE:
    "I am Iron Man, with or without my armor!" Nope, you're just Tony Stark without the armor, bud. Why the fuck would you let a woman convince you to destroy your work? Especially when it's single-handedly responsible for saving New York from nuclear obliteration? Seems a bit necessary to me.

    I... wow. I'm kind of not even sure where to start with that thought.

    I actually kind of agree with one part of that..
    Operation Clean Sweep seems to be a bit callous and shows complete disregard for all of his work. I don't feel like any real craftsman would do that to his creations.

    I don't want to touch the misogyny with an army of autonomous robots, though.

    The way I took that was
    The copious amount of armors was a coping mechanism. His initiating of Operation Clean Sweep was him recognizing that it was unhealthy to waste away his life building armor after armor, and instead focusing on what was important in his life (in this case, Pepper).

    The "I am Iron Man." at the end, coupled with his recovery of some of the lab equipment, makes me think that he's not going to give up actually being Iron Man or building suits. I think he just need a fresh start after spending the past few months doing nothing but making armors and dealing with his anxiety. Now when he makes a suit of armor or two, it won't be because he can't sleep at night.

    Right, no, that was what they were aiming for with that arc.

    I just didn't entirely like how it played out.
    The suits are humanized during the fight scene, and take on their own personalities. They saved his ass, then he just callously blows them all up.

    It'd be something if he was just scrapping a giant pile of non-functional armor, but it wasn't. I actually felt bad for the suits at that point.

    I get that he's a man, not just the occupant of a suit, but they are also more than just metal and programming and deserve better.

    No they're not
    They're just metal
    They're not even programming! Jarvis is controlling them all in that fight scene
    I mean, if they felt more human to you then, okay, that's your perspective
    But they are still just hunks of metal (hastily slapped together metal at that) and I don't think blowing them up is any real crime

    edit: as ever, @Langly has bested me
    Grey Ghost on
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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Antimatter wrote: »
    i think something that could lead people to be frustrated with tony is that
    he did need all those suits to save the day

    Chalk that up to movie luck. Itll undoubtedly never be brought up again
  • sarukunsarukun Carl Edgar Blake II Nerd-King of BaconRegistered User regular
    Best Geth agree.
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