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A Thread of A Series of Books of A Song of Ice and Fire (BOOK AND TV SPOILERS HERE)

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Posts

  • poshnialloposhniallo Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.
    poshniallo on
    Neal Stephenson wrote:
    It was, of course, nothing more than sexism, the especially virulent type espoused by male techies who sincerely believe that they are too smart to be sexists.
  • CowSharkCowShark Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Ned also had a giant book of marriage histories.

    That too, and I'd say primarily. The entire history of the Baratheon family has dark haired Baratheons marrying blonde women and producing only more dark haired kids. And, suddenly, three Baratheon kids are born blonde of hair.

    A bunch of bastards looking like Robert moreso than his "actual kids" is one thing, but for "his" kids to be the exception to a rule that's been the case for the entire recorded history of the family...

    Not just blondes, but Lannister blondes, and same results when coupling Lannister men with Baratheon women as well.

    When Eddard is confronting Cersei about her infidelity, he thinks back to how he's gone through the big book of family trees pretty thoroughly. Ned was learning about genetics before he died!

    "Grand Maester Malleon recorded the last mating between stag and lion, some ninety years ago, when Tya Lannister wed Gowen Baratheon, third son of the reigning lord. Their only issue, an unnamed boy described in Malleon’s tome as a large and lusty lad born with a full head of black hair, died in infancy. Thirty years before that a male Lannister had taken a Baratheon maid to wife. She had given him three daughters and a son, each black-haired. No matter how far back Ned searched in the brittle yellowed pages, always he found the gold yielding before the coal."

    Makes me shake my head that Shireen on the TV show doesn't have darker hair. All the fan art of her from before the TV show was like, "Oh, of course she has black hair. She's a Baratheon."
    CowShark on
  • LoserForHireXLoserForHireX Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    It's also not been shown that the world is anything but very traditional. Traditionally this has always happened, so this is expected. People so far have not been shown to be outside the box thinkers about the natural world.
    "The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde

    11843-1.png
  • PoolCuePoolCue Registered User regular
    So now that Ros has died I guess that will be the setup for Cersei finding out Shae's connection to Tyrion?
  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    CowShark wrote: »
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Ned also had a giant book of marriage histories.

    That too, and I'd say primarily. The entire history of the Baratheon family has dark haired Baratheons marrying blonde women and producing only more dark haired kids. And, suddenly, three Baratheon kids are born blonde of hair.

    A bunch of bastards looking like Robert moreso than his "actual kids" is one thing, but for "his" kids to be the exception to a rule that's been the case for the entire recorded history of the family...

    Not just blondes, but Lannister blondes, and same results when coupling Lannister men with Baratheon women as well.

    When Eddard is confronting Cersei about her infidelity, he thinks back to how he's gone through the big book of family trees pretty thoroughly. Ned was learning about genetics before he died!

    "Grand Maester Malleon recorded the last mating between stag and lion, some ninety years ago, when Tya Lannister wed Gowen Baratheon, third son of the reigning lord. Their only issue, an unnamed boy described in Malleon’s tome as a large and lusty lad born with a full head of black hair, died in infancy. Thirty years before that a male Lannister had taken a Baratheon maid to wife. She had given him three daughters and a son, each black-haired. No matter how far back Ned searched in the brittle yellowed pages, always he found the gold yielding before the coal."

    Makes me shake my head that Shireen on the TV show doesn't have darker hair. All the fan art of her from before the TV show was like, "Oh, of course she has black hair. She's a Baratheon."

    To be fair when I was shireen's age I had blonde hair too

    Now it's just brown.
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    CowShark wrote: »
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Ned also had a giant book of marriage histories.

    That too, and I'd say primarily. The entire history of the Baratheon family has dark haired Baratheons marrying blonde women and producing only more dark haired kids. And, suddenly, three Baratheon kids are born blonde of hair.

    A bunch of bastards looking like Robert moreso than his "actual kids" is one thing, but for "his" kids to be the exception to a rule that's been the case for the entire recorded history of the family...

    Not just blondes, but Lannister blondes, and same results when coupling Lannister men with Baratheon women as well.

    When Eddard is confronting Cersei about her infidelity, he thinks back to how he's gone through the big book of family trees pretty thoroughly. Ned was learning about genetics before he died!

    "Grand Maester Malleon recorded the last mating between stag and lion, some ninety years ago, when Tya Lannister wed Gowen Baratheon, third son of the reigning lord. Their only issue, an unnamed boy described in Malleon’s tome as a large and lusty lad born with a full head of black hair, died in infancy. Thirty years before that a male Lannister had taken a Baratheon maid to wife. She had given him three daughters and a son, each black-haired. No matter how far back Ned searched in the brittle yellowed pages, always he found the gold yielding before the coal."

    Makes me shake my head that Shireen on the TV show doesn't have darker hair. All the fan art of her from before the TV show was like, "Oh, of course she has black hair. She's a Baratheon."

    To be fair when I was shireen's age I had blonde hair too

    Now it's just brown.

    You were replaced by a Skrull Faceless Man, though.
  • ComradebotComradebot Lord of Dinosaurs Hunts Vegas, TXRegistered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    CowShark wrote: »
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Ned also had a giant book of marriage histories.

    That too, and I'd say primarily. The entire history of the Baratheon family has dark haired Baratheons marrying blonde women and producing only more dark haired kids. And, suddenly, three Baratheon kids are born blonde of hair.

    A bunch of bastards looking like Robert moreso than his "actual kids" is one thing, but for "his" kids to be the exception to a rule that's been the case for the entire recorded history of the family...

    Not just blondes, but Lannister blondes, and same results when coupling Lannister men with Baratheon women as well.

    When Eddard is confronting Cersei about her infidelity, he thinks back to how he's gone through the big book of family trees pretty thoroughly. Ned was learning about genetics before he died!

    "Grand Maester Malleon recorded the last mating between stag and lion, some ninety years ago, when Tya Lannister wed Gowen Baratheon, third son of the reigning lord. Their only issue, an unnamed boy described in Malleon’s tome as a large and lusty lad born with a full head of black hair, died in infancy. Thirty years before that a male Lannister had taken a Baratheon maid to wife. She had given him three daughters and a son, each black-haired. No matter how far back Ned searched in the brittle yellowed pages, always he found the gold yielding before the coal."

    Makes me shake my head that Shireen on the TV show doesn't have darker hair. All the fan art of her from before the TV show was like, "Oh, of course she has black hair. She's a Baratheon."

    To be fair when I was shireen's age I had blonde hair too

    Now it's just brown.

    Same. When I was little, my hair was bright blonde. Now it's damn near black.
  • BubbyBubby Registered User regular
    Mine is blonde in the summer but gets a little dark when I don't get as much sun.
  • Loren MichaelLoren Michael Registered User regular
    Bubby wrote: »
    They're gearing up Ramsay to take Joff's place when he dies early on next year.

    Ramsay is a much scarier villain than Joffrey. The latter is little more than a psychopath who lucked into a fortunate family/political position. He's fundamentally incompetent, and is only powerful because of circumstances his personality had nothing to do with. Ramsay is apparently wicked smart and is in many ways why he is where he is.

    I like the torture scenes, but not because of the torture; I like that the earlier escape incident revealed a lot about Theon's understanding of himself and his position. I like that the torture scenes since then have established Ramsay as both evil and smart, and I think this (and the glimpse of the rapey guys that Ramsay killed) show a little bit about what the Dreadfort and its ruling family are all about.
    2ezikn6.jpg
  • BlendtecBlendtec PittsburghRegistered User regular
    I dye my hair Daario blue, because I like looking completely absurd and out of place anywhere I go that isn't an anime convention.
    I also go by Twinkie in some games. Add me on Steam!
    steam_sig.png
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Bubby wrote: »
    They're gearing up Ramsay to take Joff's place when he dies early on next year.

    Ramsay is a much scarier villain than Joffrey. The latter is little more than a psychopath who lucked into a fortunate family/political position. He's fundamentally incompetent, and is only powerful because of circumstances his personality had nothing to do with. Ramsay is apparently wicked smart and is in many ways why he is where he is.

    I like the torture scenes, but not because of the torture; I like that the earlier escape incident revealed a lot about Theon's understanding of himself and his position. I like that the torture scenes since then have established Ramsay as both evil and smart, and I think this (and the glimpse of the rapey guys that Ramsay killed) show a little bit about what the Dreadfort and its ruling family are all about.

    Problem is we're the only ones who know it's Ramsay. Show watchers are totally confused and alienated by it. Some of them have caught that yes, it's probably the Boltons, but not all. And the payoff won't come for at LEAST two more seasons. It's bad storytelling.
    My cousin made this game: Gem Pop. It's legitimately fun, particularly for people who enjoy Bejewled, Dr. Mario, Tetris, etc. kinds of games. Only two bucks! If you try it out, PM me with what you think of it.
  • Loren MichaelLoren Michael Registered User regular
    A guy I know somehow pulled off gray hair with extremely light (not bright) blue highlights.

    Looked fucking awesome.
    2ezikn6.jpg
  • BlendtecBlendtec PittsburghRegistered User regular
    A guy I know somehow pulled off gray hair with extremely light (not bright) blue highlights.

    Looked fucking awesome.

    I know a few people with light hair who have pulled it off in small amounts, like highlights or tips, usually in the summer. Done right it can look great. If someone wore it like Daario though, it'd be nothing but hilarious I think.
    I also go by Twinkie in some games. Add me on Steam!
    steam_sig.png
  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    Well blond hair is theorized to be recessive in most cases

    ...

    Not that I'm implying a world with dragons, giants, and living dead follows Mendelian genetics.
    korrasig2.jpg
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Sicarii wrote: »
    Well blond hair is theorized to be recessive in most cases

    ...

    Not that I'm implying a world with dragons, giants, and living dead follows Mendelian genetics.

    It's kind of a plot point, so yes, yes it does.
    My cousin made this game: Gem Pop. It's legitimately fun, particularly for people who enjoy Bejewled, Dr. Mario, Tetris, etc. kinds of games. Only two bucks! If you try it out, PM me with what you think of it.
  • Loren MichaelLoren Michael Registered User regular
    CORRELATION MAY NOT BE EVIDENCE FOR CAUSATION
    2ezikn6.jpg
  • LoserForHireXLoserForHireX Registered User regular
    Bubby wrote: »
    They're gearing up Ramsay to take Joff's place when he dies early on next year.

    Ramsay is a much scarier villain than Joffrey. The latter is little more than a psychopath who lucked into a fortunate family/political position. He's fundamentally incompetent, and is only powerful because of circumstances his personality had nothing to do with. Ramsay is apparently wicked smart and is in many ways why he is where he is.

    I like the torture scenes, but not because of the torture; I like that the earlier escape incident revealed a lot about Theon's understanding of himself and his position. I like that the torture scenes since then have established Ramsay as both evil and smart, and I think this (and the glimpse of the rapey guys that Ramsay killed) show a little bit about what the Dreadfort and its ruling family are all about.

    Problem is we're the only ones who know it's Ramsay. Show watchers are totally confused and alienated by it. Some of them have caught that yes, it's probably the Boltons, but not all. And the payoff won't come for at LEAST two more seasons. It's bad storytelling.

    I don't expect that the show will go that long before the reveal that it's the Boltons. It's too important to leave out for so long. I actually expect them to let everyone know by the end of this season. If not, then very much by the end of next.
    "The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde

    11843-1.png
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    It still doesn't actually pay off the plot though. Why do we care until the events of ADWD. Bolton is about to establish himself as thoroughly evil in the next episode and then really, really evil two after that.
    My cousin made this game: Gem Pop. It's legitimately fun, particularly for people who enjoy Bejewled, Dr. Mario, Tetris, etc. kinds of games. Only two bucks! If you try it out, PM me with what you think of it.
  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    Sicarii wrote: »
    Well blond hair is theorized to be recessive in most cases

    ...

    Not that I'm implying a world with dragons, giants, and living dead follows Mendelian genetics.

    It's kind of a plot point, so yes, yes it does.

    Yeah but real life barely follows Mendelian genetics.
    korrasig2.jpg
  • BubbyBubby Registered User regular
    It'll be worth it in the end. When we get to the Winterfell frey pie dinner I'll finally be able to say we have arrived.
  • LoserForHireXLoserForHireX Registered User regular
    It still doesn't actually pay off the plot though. Why do we care until the events of ADWD. Bolton is about to establish himself as thoroughly evil in the next episode and then really, really evil two after that.

    That's why I figure it will get revealed this season. This will just be another reason why we consider the Boltons to be the scum of the earth. They wont just be traitors, they will be sadists. It adds another layer to their evil.

    I mean, I guess you can say that it's unnecessary, but it's not obviously so.
    "The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde

    11843-1.png
  • SicariiSicarii Registered User regular
    I really don't think there needs to be more than one more Theon episode this season. Slightly more torture, reveal it's the Boltons, done.

    Like I get that they like the actor and they can show a bit more of his transformation to Reek but honestly Theon's saga hasn't even payed off in the book yet. I can't imagine they can grind too much material out of him until his return in ADWD.
    korrasig2.jpg
  • JragghenJragghen Registered User regular
    Blendtec wrote: »
    A guy I know somehow pulled off gray hair with extremely light (not bright) blue highlights.

    Looked fucking awesome.

    I know a few people with light hair who have pulled it off in small amounts, like highlights or tips, usually in the summer. Done right it can look great. If someone wore it like Daario though, it'd be nothing but hilarious I think.

    You need the mustache to pull it off.
    sig.gif
  • LoserForHireXLoserForHireX Registered User regular
    Sicarii wrote: »
    I really don't think there needs to be more than one more Theon episode this season. Slightly more torture, reveal it's the Boltons, done.

    Like I get that they like the actor and they can show a bit more of his transformation to Reek but honestly Theon's saga hasn't even payed off in the book yet. I can't imagine they can grind too much material out of him until his return in ADWD.

    That's what I'm figuring. Give him a couple spots in episodes next season, to keep it fresh and mostly just to sell the whole Reek thing, and then carry on full force once they start in on the AFFC/DWD seasons
    "The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde

    11843-1.png
  • TaminTamin Registered User regular
    valiance wrote: »
    Leigh Butler is doing an unspoiled readthrough of ASOIAF: http://www.tor.com/features/series/a-read-of-ice-and-fire

    Thanks, again, for this.

    From part 31
    Uh.

    What, uh. Um.

    *blink*

    *blink*

    Holy — did they — are you — but.

    I don’t — Really?

    Ned’s dead? For real, no lie? Like, D-E-D, dead?

    But. Uh.

    I feel like we need a ruling on this.

    …Seriously? Because, uh.

    ...

    And thus I, the reader, am given official notice that the gloves are off, if they were ever even on, and no character is safe. Characters are cattle, Alfred, got it. Duly noted.

    perfect
  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    valiance wrote: »
    Leigh Butler is doing an unspoiled readthrough of ASOIAF: http://www.tor.com/features/series/a-read-of-ice-and-fire

    Seriously, this blog is awesome, thanks for linking it!

    Spawnbroker on
  • ShadowhopeShadowhope Registered User regular

    When I realized a few months ago that Leigh would reach the Red Wedding at about the same time as the show, I basically did a spit take followed by a happy dance of sadistic glee.




    Regarding blonde hair: just because it's a recessive trait on earth doesn't mean that it's a recessive trait on Westeros. Alternatively, the gene that gives Lannisters blonde hair could be different from the one that gives Shireen blonde hair, different genes having the same visible effect.
    steam_sig-400.png
  • reVersereVerse The shadow's come to stay Registered User regular
    Shireen's hair could've gone fair because of the grayscale.
  • YarYar Registered User regular
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    Yeah so replace Cersei with Tywin. He could have theoretically claimed that his seed is so strong that even his daughter would birth blonde babies to a Boratheon. Again, unless you're going to talk actual genetics, it's kind of hard to say that other Boratheons having brown-haired children, or even this Boratheon having them with other women, means anything about what kind of child he'd have with his wife.

    I just don't see it playing out. Like, standing up in front of, what, the Small Council, and showing them a few brunette bastards and a book about Boratheon lineage? I don't see how that is going to be throne-toppling truth. Not unless you've got the muscle to take the throne regardless.

    poshniallo wrote: »
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.

    I guess I read different books. Children bashed to death with gauntlet fists, women placed naked in stocks for gangs to have their way with, rather lengthy dsecriptions of flaying Theon's finger and leaving it to fester. It was only during certain parts of certain books, but it seemed that when gurm got a bit of block, he'd just write the most horrible things he could think of for a while.
  • ComradebotComradebot Lord of Dinosaurs Hunts Vegas, TXRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Yar wrote: »
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    Yeah so replace Cersei with Tywin. He could have theoretically claimed that his seed is so strong that even his daughter would birth blonde babies to a Boratheon. Again, unless you're going to talk actual genetics, it's kind of hard to say that other Boratheons having brown-haired children, or even this Boratheon having them with other women, means anything about what kind of child he'd have with his wife.

    I just don't see it playing out. Like, standing up in front of, what, the Small Council, and showing them a few brunette bastards and a book about Boratheon lineage? I don't see how that is going to be throne-toppling truth. Not unless you've got the muscle to take the throne regardless.

    poshniallo wrote: »
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.

    I guess I read different books. Children bashed to death with gauntlet fists, women placed naked in stocks for gangs to have their way with, rather lengthy dsecriptions of flaying Theon's finger and leaving it to fester. It was only during certain parts of certain books, but it seemed that when gurm got a bit of block, he'd just write the most horrible things he could think of for a while.

    Don't forget the scene where a bunch of disemboweled, crucified, mostly still alive children were pointing the way to Meereen. (I think it was Meereen)

    And then the talk of the violent gangrape of a young girl by the Mountain and his men while her family watched. Clearly, Berric Dondarrion might've been hiding in her vagina, and they all needed to check.

    Oh, and all of Joff's animal abuse, from using rabbits and cats for target practice, to leaving said cat to slowly suffer and die, to how Tommen once had a pet fawn that Joff had killed and skinned so he could wear it (which is a horribly dickish move to do to your little brother).

    Oh, and how Ramsay forces Theon to go down on Jeyne while he watches.

    Then there was the time The Mountain fed Vargo Hoat pieces of Vargo Hoat.


    EDIT: Yes, it's Meereen. They nailed up children pointing towards the city, and then Strong Belwas dropped a deuce towards the city. Personally, I hope we get to see Barristan do that instead.
    Comradebot on
  • jimb213jimb213 Registered User regular
    I get tired of the extreme level of pessimism some people have - "it could pay off, but I'm just going to assume it's not, so this plot line sucks". I feel like the show has earned at least some benefit of the doubt.
    That's the main thing for me. The show should have earned the benefit of the doubt by now.
  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    Yeah so replace Cersei with Tywin. He could have theoretically claimed that his seed is so strong that even his daughter would birth blonde babies to a Boratheon. Again, unless you're going to talk actual genetics, it's kind of hard to say that other Boratheons having brown-haired children, or even this Boratheon having them with other women, means anything about what kind of child he'd have with his wife.

    I just don't see it playing out. Like, standing up in front of, what, the Small Council, and showing them a few brunette bastards and a book about Boratheon lineage? I don't see how that is going to be throne-toppling truth. Not unless you've got the muscle to take the throne regardless.

    poshniallo wrote: »
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.

    I guess I read different books. Children bashed to death with gauntlet fists, women placed naked in stocks for gangs to have their way with, rather lengthy dsecriptions of flaying Theon's finger and leaving it to fester. It was only during certain parts of certain books, but it seemed that when gurm got a bit of block, he'd just write the most horrible things he could think of for a while.

    Don't forget the scene where a bunch of disemboweled, crucified, mostly still alive children were pointing the way to Meereen. (I think it was Meereen)

    And then the talk of the violent gangrape of a young girl by the Mountain and his men while her family watched. Clearly, Berric Dondarrion might've been hiding in her vagina, and they all needed to check.

    Oh, and all of Joff's animal abuse, from using rabbits and cats for target practice, to leaving said cat to slowly suffer and die, to how Tommen once had a pet fawn that Joff had killed and skinned so he could wear it (which is a horribly dickish move to do to your little brother).

    Oh, and how Ramsay forces Theon to go down on Jeyne while he watches.

    Then there was the time The Mountain fed Vargo Hoat pieces of Vargo Hoat.

    Wait, when did Jon Snow teach Theon how to cunnilingus

    this plot hole is ridiculous I want my money back
  • ComradebotComradebot Lord of Dinosaurs Hunts Vegas, TXRegistered User regular
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    Yeah so replace Cersei with Tywin. He could have theoretically claimed that his seed is so strong that even his daughter would birth blonde babies to a Boratheon. Again, unless you're going to talk actual genetics, it's kind of hard to say that other Boratheons having brown-haired children, or even this Boratheon having them with other women, means anything about what kind of child he'd have with his wife.

    I just don't see it playing out. Like, standing up in front of, what, the Small Council, and showing them a few brunette bastards and a book about Boratheon lineage? I don't see how that is going to be throne-toppling truth. Not unless you've got the muscle to take the throne regardless.

    poshniallo wrote: »
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.

    I guess I read different books. Children bashed to death with gauntlet fists, women placed naked in stocks for gangs to have their way with, rather lengthy dsecriptions of flaying Theon's finger and leaving it to fester. It was only during certain parts of certain books, but it seemed that when gurm got a bit of block, he'd just write the most horrible things he could think of for a while.

    Don't forget the scene where a bunch of disemboweled, crucified, mostly still alive children were pointing the way to Meereen. (I think it was Meereen)

    And then the talk of the violent gangrape of a young girl by the Mountain and his men while her family watched. Clearly, Berric Dondarrion might've been hiding in her vagina, and they all needed to check.

    Oh, and all of Joff's animal abuse, from using rabbits and cats for target practice, to leaving said cat to slowly suffer and die, to how Tommen once had a pet fawn that Joff had killed and skinned so he could wear it (which is a horribly dickish move to do to your little brother).

    Oh, and how Ramsay forces Theon to go down on Jeyne while he watches.

    Then there was the time The Mountain fed Vargo Hoat pieces of Vargo Hoat.

    Wait, when did Jon Snow teach Theon how to cunnilingus

    this plot hole is ridiculous I want my money back

    Clearly, Ramsay warged into Ygritte's lady parts.
  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    reVerse wrote: »
    Yar wrote: »
    I always wondered about that, though. Absent some scientific evidence about recessive genetics, couldn't Cersei just say, "well, no Boratheon ever married a Lioness with a womb as powerful as Cersei Lannister's!" I mean, "the seed is strong" kinda opens itself up for its own counter-argument.

    She could say that.

    But it's a patriarchy. Women are inferior.

    Yeah so replace Cersei with Tywin. He could have theoretically claimed that his seed is so strong that even his daughter would birth blonde babies to a Boratheon. Again, unless you're going to talk actual genetics, it's kind of hard to say that other Boratheons having brown-haired children, or even this Boratheon having them with other women, means anything about what kind of child he'd have with his wife.

    I just don't see it playing out. Like, standing up in front of, what, the Small Council, and showing them a few brunette bastards and a book about Boratheon lineage? I don't see how that is going to be throne-toppling truth. Not unless you've got the muscle to take the throne regardless.

    poshniallo wrote: »
    I don't remember any shocking torture from the book. I remember Arya telling us that the Tickler tortured people, and being told or hinted about what happened to Theon.

    I mean, I know the slaves were treated terribly, for example. But I don't remember any graphic torture scenes, especially with children in. I don't know what Yar is talking about.

    I guess I read different books. Children bashed to death with gauntlet fists, women placed naked in stocks for gangs to have their way with, rather lengthy dsecriptions of flaying Theon's finger and leaving it to fester. It was only during certain parts of certain books, but it seemed that when gurm got a bit of block, he'd just write the most horrible things he could think of for a while.

    Don't forget the scene where a bunch of disemboweled, crucified, mostly still alive children were pointing the way to Meereen. (I think it was Meereen)

    And then the talk of the violent gangrape of a young girl by the Mountain and his men while her family watched. Clearly, Berric Dondarrion might've been hiding in her vagina, and they all needed to check.

    Oh, and all of Joff's animal abuse, from using rabbits and cats for target practice, to leaving said cat to slowly suffer and die, to how Tommen once had a pet fawn that Joff had killed and skinned so he could wear it (which is a horribly dickish move to do to your little brother).

    Oh, and how Ramsay forces Theon to go down on Jeyne while he watches.

    Then there was the time The Mountain fed Vargo Hoat pieces of Vargo Hoat.


    EDIT: Yes, it's Meereen. They nailed up children pointing towards the city, and then Strong Belwas dropped a deuce towards the city. Personally, I hope we get to see Barristan do that instead.

    That's Joffrey being Joffrey. It'd be out of character for him not to do that.
  • Giggles_FunsworthGiggles_Funsworth Paranoiac Bay Area SprawlRegistered User regular
    Man, as upset as I was, and am, about lack of Strong Belwas. How the fuck they gonna do the Red Wedding without the Greatjon?
  • ComradebotComradebot Lord of Dinosaurs Hunts Vegas, TXRegistered User regular
    Man, as upset as I was, and am, about lack of Strong Belwas. How the fuck they gonna do the Red Wedding without the Greatjon?

    Are we not? He was re-occuring in the first couple of seasons... though I guess we haven't seen him this year, have we?
  • BubbyBubby Registered User regular
    edited May 2013
    Whatever happened to Umber, anyway? He was so awesome in S1.
    Bubby on
  • reVersereVerse The shadow's come to stay Registered User regular
    Comradebot wrote: »
    Man, as upset as I was, and am, about lack of Strong Belwas. How the fuck they gonna do the Red Wedding without the Greatjon?

    Are we not? He was re-occuring in the first couple of seasons... though I guess we haven't seen him this year, have we?

    The actor has confirmed that he hasn't filmed any scenes this season.
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    Bubby wrote: »
    Whatever happened to Umber, anyway? He was so awesome in S1.

    Apparently he's off hanging out with the real Tormund Giantsbane where they do manly things and Tormund tells jokes.
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